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Gary Taubes
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Gary Taubes - 'The Qualities of Calories: lessons from the front line, Zurich & LCHF in practice'
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О докладе

Gary Taubes is an investigative science and health journalist and co-founder of the non-profit Nutrition Science Initiative (NuSI.org). He is the author of The Case Against Sugar (2016), Why We Get Fat and What to Do About It (2011) and Good Calories, Bad Calories (2007), published as The Diet Delusion in the UK.

Taubes is the recipient of a Robert Wood Johnson Foundation Investigator Award in Health Policy Research, and has won numerous other awards for his journalism. These include the International Health Reporting Award from the Pan American Health Organization and the National Association of Science Writers Science in Society Journalism Award, which he won in 1996, 1999 and 2001. (He is the first print journalist to win this award three times.)

Taubes graduated from Harvard College in 1977 with an S.B. degree in applied physics, and received an M.S. degree in engineering from Stanford University (1978) and in journalism from Columbia.

О спикере

Gary Taubes
Co-founder в Nutrition Science Initiative

Gary Taubes is an American journalist, writer and low-carbohydrate diet advocate. He is the author of Nobel Dreams (1987), Bad Science: The Short Life and Weird Times of Cold Fusion (1993), and Good Calories, Bad Calories (2007), titled The Diet Delusion (2008) in the UK and Australia. His book Why We Get Fat: And What to Do About It was released in December 2010. His central hypothesis is that carbohydrates over-stimulate the secretion of insulin, which causes the body to store fat. Some of the views propounded by Taubes are inconsistent with known science surrounding obesity.

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Thank you. I want to start off by saying I do not have a black belt in Taekwondo, but I was knocked unconscious boxing. I may have CTE remains to be seen this talk is actually written the first draft. This talk was written in Zurich at this meeting that the Swiss re host. And after we had a long meeting with the bmj and I had listen to good Dairy. Dr. Moses Marion speak and I thought in the course of this meeting he captured perfectly. My favorite game on nutrition you got closer than anyone else. Even the

basic banana cut this amazing. And yeah, did you guys probably have the same experience? There's so much what he says that I disagree with. And I sat down at night until about 3 in the morning that night was a Saturday night. I was wrestling with this issue of why is it weekly so close to the way we think that some things into a different from the way I think on others and put together slideshow that I presented the next day. The Following fall is part of a research for my Nextbook. I

interviewed a hundred plus Physicians who prescribe low-carb high-fat diet so their patients who have converted for lack of a better word. If I got a few Point From The Trenches so to speak from the Frontline of nutrition science of people actually stuck with trying to make their patients healthier trying to make themselves healthier. So all of this is combined into the talking to give the tries to put everything in perspective to understand where we disagree and why we disagree and why it's so profound other than that bacon thing which you know, it's just wrong.

Okay, my disclosures I get book royalties for writing books that push people do not even single macronutrient. I get on a Miriam for giving talks in CrossFit has been graciously supporting me lately. I wanted to put this off for about the Obesity that they for science. It was 1986-1990 Susan 1998. And it's a time there maybe a half-dozen physicians in the US who are prescribing these low-carb high-fat ketogenic diet. They were all sort of considered quacks half of them and probably wouldn't books and they

use a die, but they thought it would kill them. So you going to diet to lose weight and then you go off to die and then you gain the weight back and you psycho in this was sort of in the dog man at the time was that we should always low-fat calorie restricted diet ketogenic diets going to kill you. If you want to lose weight. If you have to eat a calorie-restricted diet and it's got to be low-fat to prevent heart disease North are on Obesity in the Obesity epidemic and

it's really fascinating how to change between 98 and 2001 in my researches. I have clinical trials to look at by people like David Ludwig and Eric Westman who were early adopters of carbohydrate restricted diet. So when I did my research and dressing the same program and when Malcolm said, he said we mustn't take in more calories when we cannot lose weight if you don't exercise A few of us are able to actually follow this advice as either our fault that the

fault of the advise medical Orthodoxy naturally tends towards the former position diet books tend towards the latter medical Orthodoxy has been wrong in the past that position is not in his face irrational worth finding out whether it's true. And then what he did is he sort of did his research and bought into the medical orthodox? I came along three years later. And the first thing I did my research. I spend a few days with David Ludwig at is pediatric obesity clinic at Harvard and David, you know the people at Harvard you respect them right like bacon.

Anyway, so I had a different perspective. I could be SantaCon skeptical in a way that Malcolm couldn't because I had very few know that there's a different way to look at this and kind of agreeing with the diet. And now I can tell this interesting story talked about how diet books all have the same thing. They said they have a conversion narrative in it. So in this case Askins is a conversion narrative at its finest. Dr. Adkins humble corporate position is fatty begin searching for answers key test is unorthodox views on himself. Is it by Magic? He loses weight to test his

unorthodox views on patients as if by Magic they lose weight incredibly is come up with the diet that produces steady weight loss while setting no limit on the amount of food to feed it's dark in here so we can't really see this is exactly like that. Like virtually everyone right? And no one in my Revelations was that in order to break away from the dog while you have to let dog my has to fail you in some way this what I learned in to be if your patients are getting heavier and more diabetic each year and you're telling them they'd last exercise Maury mostly plans.

You're giving him the conventional wisdom and it's not working and it's getting kind of the diabetes and obesity epidemic spouse. It's not working there is getting fatter and more and more diabetic and you either have to blame them. So you're saying they're not trying which is when most of us would do this not trying hard enough, right? That's where all the facts payment comes in. By the way, there's from where I'm standing there's feedback and if we can get rid of that, that would be nice. Or if the same things happening to you like Atkins, if you're a

humble corporate physician getting fatter and then you decide while I know I'm following my advice. So maybe it's not my advice. My my patients who are failing Me Maybe. My advice is failing me. And now you have a observation that is at odds with your expectation. That's where science science begins with an observation that your expectations wouldn't have predicted. So you do your homework you find a diet that seems to work at the exact opposite of what we've been told to eat. Now you try it on your patience and everything goes from there. It's exactly what's happened to most of

the position to have now come along to sort of convert to this way of thinking. So if you look at the State of Affairs in 2019 memory settings 1998 there maybe half a dozen physicians in the country in America in Thousands now maybe I'm estimating tens of thousands of positions worldwide based on this number from Canada, which is the Canadian women Physicians low-carb high-fat Network and only women Physicians their 30s almost thirty seven hundred of them in Canada alone. So free Sim is a reasonable number of male physicians in Canada who is also converted. We could ask them a tens of

thousands of positions worldwide who are now eating a diet that is completely at odds and prescribing and completely at odds to what medical Orthodoxy says they should do in 2017. There was this letter in the Huffington Post that was sort of organized by Evelyn board to our growing a young physician in Montreal. It was over a hundred Canadian positions. co-signed it This is what they said, but we see in our clinics blood sugar values go down blood pressure drops chronic pain decreases or disappears lipid profile to improve inflammatory markers improve energy

increases weight decreases sleep has improved IBS symptoms in our lesson medication is adjusted down or even eliminated which reduce the side effects for patients results. We achieved their patients are impressive and durable a phrase. I heard over and over again from the Canadian Physicians. I interviewed with they cannot unsee. what they say in their patients this conversion experience is so that is Trump's the dietary advice from the health. Organizations that trumps everything they've been told to do because what they're saying is

I can make my patient healthy. If I get them teeth this way. So down three months after the Huffington Post letter comes out the US News & World Report. Annuals dietary guidelines the 2009 version of updated if it hasn't changed much and this is the other conflict that I had in trying to write this report. How can this be possible? So you have a hundred plus Physicians that's a lot out of it. I guess you could have done 3,600 women co-signers if you had tried

experts the authorities a committee of authorities for the US News and report that will tell you the healthiest Thai in the world the best of the Mediterranean diet. This fight came out then the next staff next is the flexitarian diet. There are rich in fruits vegetables whole grains everything Jerry thinks we should eat. Did you get the number 20 and get the sort of? politically acceptable versions of Adkins so Adkins in South Beach or Tide of 20th with the vegan diet, which we have no ideas with long-term health

benefits and then down at the bottom hardcore ketogenic Palio is 33 at drop some 20 and 2018 and then Adkins keto Whole 30 and have no idea what the good diets for weight loss at the same thing Weight Watchers is number one volumetrics and I do not think anyone is cared about for at least 20 years and fiber rolls presented itself book is about 2 million on Amazon is number 2 and then the flexitarian diet despite that he's always catching on so we can we have this conflict

between what what we're being told to eat with the nutritional shorties, whether they're right or wrong or telling us to eat and what's actually happening out there and recently there was this article on CNN talking about how Weight Watchers stock is down and Oprah Winfrey's stock in Weight Watchers is down because Tito is taking over the world and dietdoctor.com is putting them out of business and she referred to To fight the keto is the Kia Sorge. I thought that by the way, the photo was that I'm glad that Weight Watchers is selling

calorie-restricted versions of ice cream cones. Vanilla Fudge stripe maturing. I'm assuming they're low-calorie, but they probably okay. The conventional wisdom is on the defensive are they don't actually see it happening. So if this New York Times article, it's about a study that I knew she funded the key to weight loss is Diet quality not quantity a new study finds. So we're moving into this thinking that it's about quality of the defining what we mean by quality very well. But then you still get the hardcore defense in this is I just I don't know if you

guys saw this was an article New York Magazine the last conversation we need to have about eating right by the associated nutritionist David Captain Mark Bittman of former colonists at the New York Times and you know, if there's one thing I know for sure it's a carbs are evil and all plant foods are carbohydrates are that can't be true. But you have a carbs are in everything from lentils to Lollipops are different kind of car. I'm sure but I should still avoid carbs. Right exactly. The opposite is true or helpful diet without carbs and led to believe that car is a Revolt because you've

been reading Gary towns on Highway processed grains and added sugars are bad. Is that healthy? There's no evidence that such diets are conducive to good health in the long run test an interesting point. Okay, cuz we've seen evidence that there are conducive to good health in the short run set the point. Where going to come back to Nanny says they say not everything that causes weight loss repair metabolic Improvement in the short-term is a good idea caller of friends since causes weight blood sugar and blood lipids. That doesn't mean you want it. That's the only time

I've ever used an emoji in a lecture. Okay. So what's going on here? How do we make sense of this? And I'm going to give Martin Andrea a physician in Vancouver South African. He's working North Vancouver. I'm going to give him credit for putting some of these thoughts in my mind. I'm embarrassed at work on the silver 20 years. I didn't think about it. Martin said you know what we have here is we've been telling for telling people to prescribe bye-bye hypothesis. We have hypotheses of what constitutes a healthy diet. That'll make them live longer. And then we have

to find experience. I put somebody on a low-carb high-fat ketogenic diet. I see them get healthy hair. So a lot of what document ethereum to talk about his lecture in my mind of hypotheses about increasing the length and healthspan and lifespan and you don't even know if they're True Food in randomized control trial you would know if it be true for you cuz you'll get some probabilistic estimate of whether or not this diet is a good idea that you will live longer. If you eat friends and plan oils instead of animal fat and then the contrary to what you can't unsee is what happens to

yourself and what happens to your clinic. I cannot unsee the fact that I'm 30 pounds lighter than I used to be effortlessly. Okay. I may be killing myself and I worry about it daily cuz it would be a real blow. I am on bias. I don't know one of the members of the audience accused the discussion of being hijacked by discussions of the low-carb high-fat ketogenic diet because it was discussed for about the first time ever perhaps in a mainstream nutrition lecture

is the first is energy balance and its implications and I speak about a little bit differently than Giacomo seferian dead, but This was one of the articles that came out of the bmj Swiss re conferencing. Is he at the top right of the key messages and balance between calorie and taking calorie spinach or determines body weight and body-fat. So this is at the most informed nutrition conference in the country and the authorities still were willing Michael Lane and colleagues were willing to say that this is what determines intake and expenditure the sort of 19200

science. It's about 18600 sign. It means people pre obese people people Arlene I eat at one time when we were young are equal to the same as lean people - ability to remain in energy. Okay, I'm dead serious about this hypothesis means that. The difference between lie like when I was in high school my senior in high school. I weighed 195 lb, I was 62 and I played football in my brother his senior in high-school weigh 295 lbs 6 ft 4, and he played football and he never got over a hundred ninety-five pounds in his life. Where's I went up to 2:40? And according to this energy balance Theory the

difference between us the only measurable difference was that I couldn't control my energy balance and he could the day I probably weighs 70 lb more than him and it still says nothing about whether we're just physiologically different. It just says that you could control with energy balance. I can't or I couldn't. Capri of these people Arlene p 4 - will power affect that's what the theory that's where the fat shaming comes from and then pre obese people equals when people plus gluttony and sloth I'll look at it. Again. It's all faxing. This is he direct implication of this caloric balance

at the other energy balance is determined by our intake and expenditure. Okay, healthy diet minus the excess calories is what we should be eating cuz we're getting we're the same as lean people plus excess calories are so plus will power. This is where you get ideas like not too much. Some guy who says he's not too much. That's what they mean. They mean you eat with healthy people eat, but you would not as much of it or not too much when you won't get fat. That's the theory. So what do we mean by hell?

And that's one nutritional epidemiology and its implications come in and this is where dr. Mosley Ferry and I have conflicts you get studies like this from the Harvard School of Public Health buffalo on high carb diet can raise rates in Berlin. I should have replaces with the recent study showing that claiming that low carb diet can raise risk of atrial fibrillation. Although what they mean is that the increased risk of atrial fibrillation is no causality there and then you end up with conclusions like Dairy faultless, which is I'm going to show this sort of definition of a

healthy diet more list of fine the conventional thinking It costs and most places on a healthy diet and your foods are good for us and foods that are not good for us. And then there are some foods that we didn't have the 20th. So standing of epidemiology and I hope we can clarify this and again, this is so simple that I think it must be wrong. So feel free at our discussion to explain why it so I can do want to ask you about this is you look and see what healthy people eat compared to what unhealthy people eat. It said its simplest level and then you would assume that if

we always like the healthy people we'd be healthy to is that kind of? Okay, so we're going to discuss this later. Because we're concerned with this sort of metabolic syndrome Foster obesity diabetes metabolic syndrome these diseases that we think of as diseases of Western diet and lifestyle that are epidemic all around the world today as our Western dieting lifestyle spread all around the world. We're looking at healthy people compared to people who aren't obese and aren't diabetic and don't have metabolic syndrome. So that's kind of the comparison. That's how

I see it and a hypothesis. Is it food that healthy people attended are better for all of us than Foods at fun healthy people tend to eat until the benefit the good food the food that I made it most accurately defined as being good forces unequivocal evidence are foods that help. Therefore they're good for us and the foods that are at the bottom are things that we know unhealthy people eating and then are some nuances. So you end up with this kind of thinking we're all being told to eat food mostly plants. Not too much. But this is what healthy people do everything in

moderation. Is that everyone in the world who's lean and healthy things to eat in moderation except maybe some seventeen-year-old to know better, but will regret it later. Ordinary vegan Whole Food vegan plant-based diet the same thing the healthy eating plate. It's the same thing as its look at what healthy people eat and tell us all to eat that way. Or look at people who stayed and if you're overweight and obese be like healthy people eat, but the last him back

that's what we're being told by an additional government. So many people think I eat healthy and I exercise regularly and I remain laying there for I can tell other people to do that and they will remain Lee and also with a known as we are people who get fat and sick eating the food that they eat my take on it. So the healthy people need it because already eating healthy the people who needed R Us the ones we're not leaving and not healthy. This is what the kind

of waiting rooms of many doctors in America look like today and they're people who are obese and overweight who suffer from diabetes in or getting The Chronic complications of these diseases and they're not letting people. So maybe they need different advice. That's five. Stop those with obesity diabetes hypertension to tell these are people of the insulin resistant hyperinsulinemia phenotype. Hey, if we use genetic terminology what's happened in the world over the past hundred years is this huge explosion in this insulin resistant hyperinsulinemia, obese diabetic hypertensive

phenotype and something in the western diets driving it. These people are not just like the lean and healthy might as well power. Okay, we're physiologically different we respond to what we eating differently than they do that's this alternative hypothesis for the healthiest diet for this phenotype for us is a diet and which are phenotype is not manifested. So so if you can put someone on a diet who's this guy has obesity or type 2 diabetes or hypertension, you could change the way they eat the way that it's not a struggle. So I'm going to roll out

starving them. That's probably a healthy diet. So you can think of a conflict as being a conflict between the definition of a healthy diet, which is what lean people eat and the diet that makes people are not laying who are not healthy healthy again. Which is what the conversion experience the where you end up in that the alaskans and ketogenic diet and argue that that's the diet and minimize is insulin secretion of which is like you to genic diet to become so popular. You've heard me speak about the role of insulin on fat accumulation when

I've never really talked about a lot is something I learned doing my research when you talk to family tablet some researchers. They would use a phrase. They would say that fat cells are exquisitely sensitive to insulin. Okay. So if you want to get fat out of fat cells going to mobilize fat from fat cells that I'm using excess fat now is a proxy for all of this phenotype these again, I think of it differently as we become your PC diabetes hypertension is on manifestation of this insulin resistant hyperinsulinemia phenotype, and we can see it in ourselves when we're

getting fatter. So that tends to be what if we can take care of the excess weight we can probably taken care of the rest of the phenotype as well. So is it insulin levels come down and turns out that they have to see what the Rosalyn yalow the Nobel Laureate called the negative stimulus of insulin deficiency. And if it turns out this was measure this negative stimulus concept is measured by Ralph defronzo and his colleagues at UT San Antonio and de France was in the newspapers today for taking 6 million dollars from industry. So maybe a corrupted this study. I don't know but

fairness choirs that I say that When is the levels drop? The insulin is so sensitive diapers size are so sensitive that they hold onto fatty acids anyway, and you have to get up early. So threshold. It's almost like the switch and if your child is on the left in the in the purple circle that's below the threshold Now TV adipocytes dumb fatty acids into the bloodstream and the fat cells. Will you get much higher rates of fatty acid turn over which is what this is measuring and in the paper that the funds were the sentence in a regulation of

plasma free fatty acid turnover oxidations, maximally manifested low physiologic plasma insulin concentration and they describe the most in their studies that adipose tissue is exquisitely sensitive to be an inhibitory effect of insulin on free fatty acids release. so basically the whole idea of a ketogenic diet is my tape, which is If the Drone was taken. The practitioner take is that if you're in ketosis, you know that you're below that threshold pretty much we have to do is be below threshold mobilizing fat burning it oxidizing in the lower. You're storing

it. Do you end up with this insulin email, you know bcde hypertension in remission by Daya and toast a healthy do so by minimizing insulin secretion in maximizing the time we spent. Hello that threshold prolonging the time we end up with this conflict. Play the back to the ground. So what we need to get healthy, this is what those of us who follow a low-carb high-fat ketogenic diet eat for the most part. Okay, because they can we can eat these foods and we could eat him and quantity for the most part we can eat State iety and we can keep our insulin low and we could not be

obese in diabetic and hypertensive. It's not her and they're not fish vegetables. So these are on you know foods yogurt cheese eggs poultry slaughtering process red meat processed meats and high sodium foods are also included in the foods we eat because when we eat then we don't get noticeably unhealthy. No, they might be a prediction that I'm getting on how so you because I'm eating too much bacon and my favorite statement on that was from a shell plots Ojeda Instagram account. Delete the bacon and she was 390 pounds when she started ketogenic diet when she was down to

231 of her colleagues said Express. And she said dude, you never question my diet when I was 380. 4 yearly I'm healthier at 2:30 unless I've got cholera. So we have two different definitions of the word healthy the diet that gets a woman like Michelle from 380 down to 230 without being hungry that you could sustain for the rest of her life. She's clearly healthier 2:30 and they're all you know, where is lower triglycerides are lower each other kinds of signs of good health that have erupted in this and then we sell fighting bait. The constituents of a healthy diet,

here's what healthy people eating different. So now you've got people eating fruits and vegetables and whole grains and beans in the ideas were supposed to eat them because they're good for us are actually beneficial instead of removing the foods that are deleterious, which is what we do. In our world you add foods that are somehow good for you and then you don't eat some food that we think are bad for us. If we find that we can eat and still remain apparently healthy. So the concert is the way you think we can think of it is corrected for therapeutic nutrition. We will remove the

foods that are making us on healthy. And we replace him with faster. We get healthier. We see we get healthier we have this unsafe phenomena. So it's hard for that's one of the reasons why we are struggling with chronic disorders, and then you change your diet may seem to go away seems to demand a certain amount of zealotry. 3 minutes 3 minutes, Brown and the opposite of preventive nutrition and I think this is a vitally important fact that we're dealing with one might take him with you are trying to prevent chronic diseases. And if you eat this way, you

will live longer and live healthier. And again, they're hypothesis-driven prevention nutrition. So when we argue about the value of clinical trial, we're arguing about the value of studies that can tell us whether this is a good damn ball whether I should really change my diet in a way that I don't notice. There's nothing I have to understand. I don't notice if my LDL goes down. And you're telling me I'm going to live longer than I have to take your word for it. If I left the ninety. I don't know if I've lived in 90 because of your diet or I would have lived 100 if I hadn't switched my

diet has no we have no input. We have no there's no way God doesn't give us the information. So we have to trust the hypotheses and it got a lot of our differences are about how much were supposed to trust hypotheses. So began the conflict in perspective, you've got this insulin resistant hyperinsulinemia and phenotype People Like Us who go on a particularly unhealthy version of a healthy diet and we get healthier and then you've got the healthy phenotype telling us how we should eat. So what they believe in this when it comes to Abby's today is a very simple this is

from the textbook obesity all diets that result in weight loss Tucson one bases in one basis only they reduce total calorie intake. Are alternative fad text book about obesity what they all died as a result in weight loss Tucson one base has one base is only they reduce total carbohydrate intake improve the quality of the car. They lower the time we spend below the threshold to the two fundamentally different concept different hypotheses a reason. I started new sea and we have not succeeded yet is to test a different ideas. And then how is it

work by the alternate hypotheses fewer the carbs the longer the time between meals to find every intermittent fasting time restricted feeding off work to keep you below the threshold keep insulin low in blood sugar low and prevent this hyperinsulinemic insulin resistant phenotype for manifesting itself and the key to success at mint on. Thank you.

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