Rick Wion
Senior Director of Consumer Engagement at the Kellogg Company
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2019 Digital Innovator Summit
June 13 2019, Chicago, USA
2019 Digital Innovator Summit
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Panel: HATERS - When Consumers Attack
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About speakers

Rick Wion
Senior Director of Consumer Engagement at the Kellogg Company
Meredith Nichols
Reputation management specialist at Sears
Carolyn Rooke
Manager, Social Strategy at DigitasLBi North America
Dakota Shultz
Partner, Co-Founder at AGENCY 360
Daliah Saper
Trademark, Copyright, Media, and Business Attorney/ Founder at Saper Law
Hope Bertram
Digital Marketing Director at Digital Megaphone

I am a digital dad who started plunking through the interwebs back when we wrote HTML by long-hand in Notepad and have since moved myself some really cool organizations from the "what is the Information Superhighway" days through to Web 1.0, then Web 2.0 and now into the post-hype #social media era. #Creative #Storytelling #DigitalProductionRecently named to the AdWeek 50 for top innovators in digital marketing and recognized as a leader in Real Time Marketing.My background combines education and professional experience in journalism, UX design/development, IT systems, and public relations. Disciplines which I use for complex problem solving everyday.I have grown revenue and my functional area in every job that I've held through directing multi-level, cross-functional teams to solve complex problems across numerous industries.I have also developed profitable eLearning programs with supporting marketing campaigns; robust online communities; concept-to- launch of premium content and collaboration services, and guided the creation of industry-wide XML standards.Additional specialties include: Social Media Strategy, Online Marketing, Project Management, Business Development, Strategy Development, Technology Alignment, Product Development, Change Management, Communication Strategy, Budget Management, Creative Writing, Graphic Design

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I started my Twitter account as an assignment for a college communications class more than ten years ago, and my passion for social media snowballed from there. Since then, I've used Facebook Ads in their (very) early years to bring attendees to local music festival shows, launched the Instagram channel for one of the largest US grocery retailers, hosted Influencers at test kitchens and wine tastings, and organically grew a reality TV Twitter account over 4,400%.I'm a proven social media strategist with a passion for relationship-building, online and off. From Instagram to the influencer space, I thrive on the challenge of generating creative ideas that are also executable, business-transforming campaigns. I've worked with brands from industries including food and beverage, real estate, retail/apparel, entertainment, and non-profit arts.

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DALIAH SAPER has handled many high profile cases (including one she argued before the Illinois Supreme Court) and is regularly interviewed on national tv, radio, and in several publications including: Fox News, CNBC, ABC News, The Chicago Tribune, WGN Radio, NPR, and a slew of smaller websites. She has received the honor of being named a“Rising Star” for 11 consecutive years by Super Lawyers magazine, is recognized as a leading Media and Entertainment lawyer by Chambers and Partners, featured on the covers of TheXemplar magazine and Chicago Lawyer Magazine , profiled by the Chicago Law Bulletin, and has been nominated for the prestigious ATHENA Young Professional Leadership Award.Most significantly, Daliah was named to Crain’s Chicago‘s 2017 list “60 Most Influential Women Lawyers,” which highlighted her “cutting-edge” internet and social media practice, and Law Bulletin Publishing Company’s 2012 list “40 Attorneys Under 40,” an incredibly competitive roster of accomplished attorneys compiled from thousands of highly qualified nominations.Daliah is an Adjunct Professor at Loyola University Chicago School of Law, teaching a Sports and Entertainment Law course. She has also served as an Adjunct Professor at the University of Illinois College of Law, teaching an Internet Law course. She is on the faculty of PLI, Practicing Law Institute, and has been selected by Harvard Law School’s Berkman Center for Internet & Society to be a member of Harvard’s new Online Media Legal Netw

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Emmy Nominated Hope Bertram jumped into the digital marketing scene early on. After obtaining a Masters in Integrated Marketing from Northwestern University, she went on to interactive marketing positions with top companies such as GE, Discover Card and Sears.A true digital pioneer, Bertram developed the marketing for one of the first online loyalty programs at Coolsavings.com and went on to create an Emmy nominated social media strategy for fashion reality show, So You Wanna be a Designer, leveraging second screen tactics before the industry had a name for it.

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About the talk

Topic: Marketing

Social media attacks are a social media manager’s worst nightmare. Join us for a lively discussion, Moderated by Hope Bertram, Digital Megaphone CMO, about social media haters with:

* Rick Wion, Senior Director of Consumer Engagement at the Kellogg Company and Digital Megaphone Board Member will share his experience in this area throughout his career

* Meredith Nichols, Reputation Management Specialist at Sears about managing the social for a brand continually attacked by angry customers

* Dakota Shultz, Co-Founder of Agency 360 who managed the crisis PR and Social Media strategy when one of their clients was attached by an overzealous cat lover

* Carolyn Rooke, Manager, Social Strategy at Digitas. Carolyn managed the social channels and social strategy for brands including ALDI, GSK, Suave, Kellogg’s and The National Pork Board. She now leads social strategy for Kimberly-Clark at Digitas

* Daliah Saper from Saper Law about the legal options when dealing when haters.

Find out about our upcoming events at www.digitalmegaphone.com

00:30 Intro

01:48 The most impactful hater story – Daliah Saper

03:40 The most impactful hater story – Dakota Schultz – a cat story

09:53 The most impactful hater story – Carolyn Rooke

10:55 The most impactful hater story – Meredith Nichols

11:40 The most impactful hater story – Rick Wion

13:48 Engagement – Carolyn Rooke

14:50 Engagement – Rick Wion

15:36 Engagement – Daliah Saper

17:16 Engagement – Meredith Nichols

18:12 Deleting comments

20:10 Social media backlash – Carolyn Rooke

21:32 Social media backlash – Rick Wion

23:52 Policies on how to respond and not to – Daliah Saper

24:46 Policies on how to respond and not to – Dakota Schultz

26:03 Policies on how to respond and not to – Rick Wion

31:00 Regulations on employees getting the confidential information

32:20 Advise for small businesses dealing with negativity in social media

35:12 Negative reviews

38:06 Negative into positive

44:00 Chatbots

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This next panel is about a subject that we all don't want to have fun topic but a topic that is very relevant 00:00 who here does social media for a company? who here has in someway either be a review or a Twitter post been 00:10 attacked by a consumer? Okay. This is going to be the panel for all of you. We are going to welcome the panelist to the stage and then come on up. 00:20 let them introduce themselves in more detail, but we're getting seated we have and their Twitter names are all the Twitter names are out there so you 00:41

can go ahead and give them a tweet. We've had that for other panel too. He's one of our board members. He was just introduced the last panel answer some 00:49 questions. He's with the Kellogg Company. We have merited nickel II with Rush season reputation management at Sears. So she doesn't know anything 00:59 about getting attacked by consumers. We have a Dakota from agency at 360 and I can't wait for him to tell at least one of my favourite a true story 01:07 about cats and dogs hate cats. We love cats Heritage of the microphone, but you'll hear more about it in a second and then to bring into legal 01:16

perspective my favorite attorney Dahlia saver big round of applause. We're 01:24 going to jump right in. So we're going to have Heats of the palace more formally introduced themselves. And then they are also going to tell you their 01:34 most impactful hater story and how they handled it and we can just get started and go down the route. Okay, good afternoon. Now if I dyed my 01:41 name is Dahlia safer. I have an IP Media or social media entertainment business law firm based out of Chicago. Where are we going on 14 + years 01:51

and a large part of my practice areas are around are focused on internet issues, which necessarily means we also regularly deal 02:00 with online defamation and I'm consoling working with corporate counsel or marketing professionals and we're deciding 02:10 is this something we pursued legally if there's a hater attacks, or is it something that's better served from a PR 02:20 marketing standpoint? Peter story since I file so many of these defamation cases inevitably people like to say terrible things about me on the 02:30

internet. I have no story is that nothing shocks me anymore put it that way. For example one person created 02:39 a fake daliah saper account and basically wrote terrible things about my client as if I was saying them about my clients fortunately. They spelled my 02:49 name with an H in the middle. My name is an H the end looks so fake that I wasn't worried. Obviously. I put some notes that said 02:58 this is not me, you know disregard. So that's one and then there's another one which was a I don't want to monopolize the 03:08

time but another one where the defendant Keeps posting everyday and from a legal standpoint that makes it really difficult cuz we have this concept of 03:18 no prior restraint on free speech and I can get into any more detail as we proceed. Yeah a cyborg now 03:26 full service Communications PR social media event production 03:36 sponsorship town and all that kind of stuff versus as today and there's a lot of kind of crossover obviously between but I'll call PR public relations 03:46

media relations and social media relations right on call fat as a hope alluded to it. It's a funny story now but 03:54 is a quick show of hands who has pets. Okay, if you have cats leave your hands up if you would admit it's kind of being slightly obsessed by your 04:04 relationship with your cat. Leave your hands up still like this. So that the short version of this we have a client 04:14 Hawthorne race course, which is on the southwest side. They've been there. It's a family-owned business a hundred and ten years, right? So, you know 04:23

nice story. They're very very good people the family runs the business. It's a race course and it's been there. Like I said for over a century 04:32 there can be as many as 2,000 horses on the property of the time to think of it really is a farm in an agribusiness kind of spacing and the barns a 04:42 but I'm a Waste Management Facility to so as you could imagine there are lots of cats, you know, if there's cats at every single race 04:51 track in America there always have been there are crazy cat people too. So there was a Who decided it was her obligation to to take care of these 05:01

wild feral cats and the racetrack allowed it for a while, right? It's like okay, you can come in and you can put our food just kind of stay out of the 05:10 way it right. Well, she kept getting more and more in the way. I was really beginning to disrupt the business and you know, this is a business that is 05:19 highly regulated to or kind of controlled by the Illinois racing board and government. Got to a point we had to kind of say you can't be back 05:27 here in the ways that we've allowed to be back here where there's horses and tractors and trucks and all this kind of stuff any longer. She kept 05:37

pushing the envelope. She wants showed up with her child, right which we had, said absolutely not like you can't have kids back here. It's it's just 05:45 too dangerous and you know, so she took this is us kicking her out of our facility what she thought of as her facility to take care of her cats. So 05:52 she went to the police and filed a police report and then she went online and she created an online petition saying, you know that she's no longer 06:02 allowed to take care of her cats and that furthermore Hawthorne was killing these cats right looks like now went totally crazy town blew up on social 06:09

media. There were like 60,000 people worldwide within a few days is it signed a petition kind of demanding that we allow this woman access to our 06:19 private property to take care of her cats before Wildcats which one in danger because if your cat in your In these barns next to waste management, 06:27 there's food everywhere like like you can't catch a mouse there. You probably shouldn't be a cat. Next thing happens 06:37 is you know, new Facebook groups pop up, you know that at the time this was this was 5 years ago, and I didn't realize how much time had passed so 06:47

Facebook was a totally different environment than an end candidly Hawthorne wasn't that active on social so like the amount of people that join these 06:55 other groups really kind of rivaled our own audience size online not to mention the 60,000 people that had signed which included contact information 07:04 not just for like the pr relations that they at the track but all of management for the Illinois racing board the governor of the mayor, please like 07:13 you name it here was phone numbers email addresses. So at one point we were getting thousands of emails a day and had to create like a special email 07:22

address just to handle the influx of this kind of stuff and we're putting out, you know, Statements of course in Kuna and all that but then the media 07:30 picked it up very quickly inside but we have to come and cover this thing because soundline it's this social thing and that's what we're going to 07:39 cover right they weren't actually as concerned about the news of what was happening or not, but that it had so much buzz on Facebook. We have to cover 07:46 this kind of thing. Right so I'll probably get into some more of it later the end of it was lots of Partnerships on our part to bring in other 07:54

experts within the genome Paws Chicago Treehouse to say no no, no one is really doing everything right care of the cats are okay. They never 08:04 were not. Okay, right and you know what eventually kind of dilute the volume that this woman was creating but something that struck me and I didn't 08:14 talk with any of you guys about this before I was looking this backup, you know, how Facebook now will give you reminders of like 5 years ago on this 08:23 day, right? So I saw that this crazy cat woman like started posting again, cuz she got a reminder from Facebook and she was like, I'm actually still 08:31

really mad about this and it was just so funny that the initial response, you know got so much. I mean like death threats like the 08:40 owners of the racetrack like their personal information was put out online. Like we had the police reports we had, you know staff at Hawthorne that 08:50 had to shut down their own personal media accounts, like what you were talking about where they were getting targeted. I mean, it was just outlandish 08:59 like we got to protect this community is all we had experts from that Community come to us privately and say get ready cuz these people 09:07

are crazy town and they're going to know so it's like these were champions of that world saying I don't envy the position that you guys are. 09:17 So thankfully the reminder that she got from Facebook wasn't nearly as in I didn't start it all up again, but I thought gosh, that's just like 09:26 technology won't let you forget that at one point you were aggrieved by something. And here we go again. So there's a lot more to that and 09:35 you know, probably going to do it more later but man 09:45

cross the Kimberly-Clark account but in 09:49 the almost 10 years that I've been a community manager, I have worked across food. I've worked across tpg retail Personal Care sport. So I've touched 09:58 a lot of different Industries and I feel like I need to give a cat story now so I can give a really quick cat anecdote. So in a past life and I was 10:07 working on a food brand we got that someone who wrote on our Facebook. I just really love the taste of your wet cat food. I know I'm not supposed to 10:16

but it's really good on French fries. It was just one of those like WTF What's that you got and I actually cut it out and hung it on 10:25 my desk as a reminder of you know, the mission that I serve is answering these people and I had to wonder you know, how many different combos had she 10:35 tried to get to the French fry pairing. But yeah, that's my cat story. I'll take that one 10:43 cold. Sober Sears 10:49 Suite 2B Sears Holdings. I am the reputation management specialist. I also work with darts engagement. So essentially it's Facebook Twitter Google and 10:59

Yelp friend much. Like you said, it's just about everything you can imagine from the human race heater stories. There's there's a 11:09 lots and one of my favorite show is that we do have people who will post everyday on Twitter almost like a countdown so I will come in and I'll be 11:19 like, so it's a 14 have we heard from Bob? just making sure but yeah, so I mean there's a lot there whole lot 11:27 there is Hi, I'm Rick. I am from Kellogg III used to help run social media at McDonald's. And 11:37

so McDonald's being Global brand sometimes can be a target for haters as well. I'll try to make it quick with two swords by 11:47 activist group come after us. In fact that a conference in New York. I had somebody rush me onstage to read their Manifesto because they were filmed 11:55 in live streaming in the social feed and then I saw another group another person from that group at a conference 3 months later that next me playing 12:04 Angry Birds on his phone and I'm like, you're supposed to be defending animals not playing video games that killed them. But another one that I dealt 12:12

with was one of the early versions in the media world of the Twitter freaks out headlines. And so we had a hashtag that we were 12:22 promoting and some comedians decided to take the hashtag in a different direction. We stop promotion on that hashtag in the end. The conversation was 12:31 going like this we stopped. Like this if the end of the day we went and we did our analysis and saw that we had 70,000 mentions of the hashtag and 12:39 there were two thousand that were negative and where they came, you know, what that's from 10% negative which in our world-time was pretty good, but 12:48

then we started seeing media coverage and it was Twitter freaks out at McDonald's over X and it just kept going and going and going and then a meeting 12:56 reaction the media stories that were nothing more than screenshots of fighting retweets became the story which was actually not an accurate 13:04 representation of the story at all, and so that became a bigger PR issued and that that that the hashtag ever was so that's my that's my hater story. 13:11 We'll talk more about it later. Thank you and getting just 13:19

mentioning mention the real story and just ignoring people. I'd love to hear from a few of you about your company Rules of Engagement about a couple 13:29 things when to engage when not to engage. And maybe Daya can pop into when to let legal handle it and we'll go from there like to get started. I can 13:38 talk a little bit about that. So we Define our Rules of Engagement really on a campaign by campaign baseness and I think that are really helpful way 13:47 that we have articulated it for a number of past Sciences with a traffic light analogy. So we have some certain topics that are always red light do 13:55

not engage do not feed the trolls things like politics things like religion like major news events that are very controversial. So we try 14:03 to steer clear of those in general. It's usually danger zone and then we stopped the yellow light a category. So these are areas where it could 14:13 potentially get controversial it could get dangerous for the Brandon. So it's proceed cautiously and we Define what those are within the context of 14:22 whatever the campaign is that were planning and then there's a green light. So if you always want to engage with your social media lovers you really 14:29

want to talk to your Advocates you want to keep nurturing those Advocates who are speaking so positively about your brand. So that's kind of our red 14:36 yellow green light and now it say that we use a lot Set the standard for what the rules are to engage. We do it some more thing at Kellogg and we have 14:44 across Our Brands. We have 80 different social channels that were managing. So, you know Fruit Loops Pop-Tarts Pringles Cheez-Its and you know that 14:54 the audience is for those brands are very very different as well. One thing I would add to that though, cuz the traffic light analogy is it is great 15:03

need to plan for that. Also. Think about how you're managing that on Facebook in terms of the app for moderation because you can you can leave a 15:09 comment you can reply to it. You can delete it or you can hide it. And so we tweet we actually take great care in terms of what we delete and what do 15:18 we hide because it's just it's a different way and also have the different signal in terms of how you're managing your overall outpatient community. 15:25 I'll be the lawyer when I when I counseled clients we first the first question is is this something that just makes you feel bad or is it 15:33

something that's actually damaging to your organization? Because it contains false information. So if it's I tasted your cat food and it tasted bad, 15:42 you know, why isn't it tasty for humans like you obviously don't care about that because it's a stupid and B. It's not really a false statement. It's 15:51 not like I gave your cat food to my cat and she died cuz that's a problem. So 16:00 that's a false verifiably false statement of fact and you have to do something about it whether it's to respond of course, but depending on how 16:09

widespread and how credible the source of that statement is. If it's just a crazy person to 70 reviews of crazy things. But if it's a viable Source, 16:18 then you want to meet Lee act in Most states. You only have one From when the post was made to actually file a lawsuit. 16:27 I have a lot of clients like we didn't care about this cuz you know, she was the crazy cat lady and she posted about this but now to your leader 16:36 Google algorithms change it is the top post on every search engine Dahlia get it down and then I'll say I can't too late. The 16:44

law says that if you didn't hurt you for the first year, you probably don't have a reason to do anything now so I can go into more detail about that. 16:54 But really when you're deciding the first question is is it just an opinion and you need to manage it or is it a false statement that you need to 17:02 immediately address because it could cause bigger problems later and we are with us. We also run our home services division. So we're Sears or Sears 17:11 Home Services Kmart Shop Your Way Craftsman Kenmore, so I'll be out of it for us. It had we have to be reactive to it because we have people who are 17:20

my texts didn't show up. My refrigerator still isn't. Working I've had my washer bloat has blown up with pictures and these are things that we have to 17:30 we get on right away. So for us we try to respond to just about everything so people know that we're there and we're at where there where you hear 17:38 your problems. If we need to we can move on it if like you said you're tweeting about your cat or we had a woman who talks in the third person for 3 17:47 Days those we just kind of let them have their their way because Barb doesn't need her monies and here's a 17:56

question. So I'm deleting comments. We are for us. We don't delete them. We don't delete them because people have a right to say what 18:05 they're going to say. And for the most part if you're deleting comments people see that the Commodore deleted and you're poking the bear. Hiding 18:15 comments are a great thing because hiding comments the person who made it can still see it is a brand can still see it. Everyone else can't see it. We 18:22 do that when personal information is given out either by the consumer or if they're giving out our personal information my physical name, 18:31

you know are not so nice to see you but someone that they can physically reach and do something with we do hide those. 18:41 Other than that. It's just it's poking the bear that because the other thing about deleting comments is that it just 18:51 opens the door for a First Amendment arguments from people who are not lawyers. It's just to be angry or 19:00 Tidings of great idea have thought of that. Thanks for sharing that anyone else delete or not anyone delete comments. Now anyway to delete 19:10

comments. Yeah. Okay good 19:20 bit of what's out there and certainly agree with kind of 19:23 hiding of comments but revisiting this later as an archive that now you can put some editing to to achieve the 19:33 goal that you want. I think it's certainly a reasonable tactic and that could involve deleting those comments 19:43 and there's been some examples of kind of tasteless tweets because the brand are trying to hop on 19:48 a topic and they don't do it. Well or where did something bad happens with the brand? So how have you handled the social media? Backlash that was a 19:58

result of a company fumble. So I can talk about this one. And I know that when we had chatted all before we did the panel on one of the examples I 20:06 brought up and send him work for DiGiorno in here. Okay, so an example that it didn't this is not a brand that I worked on but I think it's really 20:15 important for Brands when they're activating especially when they're real time activating is to really be mindful and do their research so that 20:24 they're not stepping into a cultural blind spot. And so the example that I've shared previously as a watch out is that hashtag why I stayed started 20:31

trending on Twitter as a mechanism for women to share domestic violence stories and they were talking about why it was difficult for them to leave 20:40 their abuser and often women get blamed for not being able to leave their abuser and so hashtag why I stayed with their ability to be able to explain 20:47 why it wasn't as easy as people think well DiGiorno tweeted something along the lines of hashtag why I stayed because they had pizza and it's 20:54 obviously a very, you know, tasteless reaction to something that was a very powerful way in a very vulnerable way for women to charity stories. And so 21:03

I think that for Brands it's really important that we're doing our research so that we can anticipate and no What we're stepping into when we're being 21:12 real time and when we're being agile and activating on those opportunities so you don't have to put your foot in your mouth and actually be very 21:20 insensitive. One thing I said that I would point out from went when I was at McDonald's I who are Twitter 21:27 volume, you know just grew grew grew exponentially every year it seems and we had a point where it it. It felt like we were tweeting to Consumers 21:37

every we could have committed every minute but very frequently. Oh, sorry about that. Saw your orders got messed up at the 21:46 drive-thru. Here's the here's a number call call a customer service number what will take care of it? And we don't want the Twitter feed to be 21:56 overtaken by by by just customer service issues. Even if we could get to 99% 99.9% accuracy in the restaurant third still be dozens of 22:04 the volume issue. And so we created a dedicated customer service Twitter handle with a lot of organizations have have done 22:14

out specifically to get Aunt after those issues and of that allowed us to start to push people over here where you know, if you got Dental issues 22:24 question things about contests were over here if you want to talk to somebody because your order got messed up come come come over here and that 22:34 helped us create different workflow to be able to address issues Valley customer issues when when we messed up Thanks some restaurant clients that 22:40 may have mistakenly in retrospect menu items are taking some things off without doing a due-diligence to figure out whether that was a smart move. And 22:50

then of course social media like blows up like you got rid of the sauce to whatever it was where we see that reaction and I can go in your at that 22:59 should probably be reintroduced but then using social as a way to say Hey, you know, if you feel passionately about this like here's a pole right and 23:08 it actually we're going to bring it back but now make everyone feel like they were really like empowered for doing that and create even more buzzed 23:17 with employees being easier Teresa never. Let me load it a little bit to this in a couple of the interest 23:25

stories. What kind of policies in Communications plan does your company have in place to keep employees that only on top of going on top of what's 23:34 going on, but then to give them guidelines about how to respond I'm not to respond and you look like you're not unless you have some 23:43 nice all the time and what companies pay lawyers lots of money to get this big fat Book 23:50 of Rules. And how many of you actually read your social media policies. Maybe some of you have to 24:00

last page and returning it and then just sits in a drawer. So I'm a big advocate of 24:06 yes have the policies cuz you need to legally but also have a day where you just go in and say, all right. This is what is copyright infringement. 24:16 This is right of publicity law. This is advocating for something that you shouldn't this is all these FTC guidelines from sure you're familiar with 24:24 and just having education be the driving force of what employees should and should not do not a document that you know, you have to have a new sign 24:32

and you don't really refer to I think from like Crisis management situations that what a 24:41 kind of predetermined as a policy or not, like communication internally, even if offline off social is absolutely critical, you know in every 24:51 situation there's multiple messages that you need to communicate simultaneously to different audiences and if you lose sight of that and are just 25:00 thinking like we need to make sure Barb on Twitter like is not going to freak out anymore. That's you no different than how do we make sure that the 25:06

people in the company that are feeling as if their company is being totally attacked rightly or wrongly understand what's going on and that kind of 25:15 status update to them and Clarity of purpose. And Mission is is perhaps even more important in my opinion rather than that kind of Public 25:24 Defense. Like if you value your business in your employees in your work culture, like you got a lock that down very very quickly and ensure, you know, 25:34 build on the trust that hopefully you have that we are handling this in the way because those employees if they feel as if what they're doing is being 25:43

attacked in the way that the brand is being attacked. Now, you know, those haters are actually getting into the foundation and can really ruin the 25:53 business when we revamped our social media policy a couple years ago. We also did a online and in-person training 26:01 sessions for the entire organization and we made a part of our orientation as well. And I said it as a joke one time, but then it became 26:11 part of the curriculum I said, all right, we can make this about a 30 second session if you wouldn't say to your mom or you wouldn't say to your 26:21

boss's face and don't say don't like okay good to you can even write a one pager 26:29 that that's in plain English. You can write a four-page document at the legalese in any situation. That's the thing that that that that the employees 26:39 just need to understand. Most people get that but a lot of people forget it to it which is which is unfortunate, 26:48 and if you allow them to do that only counts necessarily 26:53 creates problems later, right because you're working for Coke one day then you can work for a competitor a different Beverage Company the next day and 27:03

it's confusing because if you're advocating for your company today, and I have a different company tomorrow. What are what's happening? Also you 27:11 don't want to be investing in accumulating eyeballs and and building these on mine assets and have them be in different places based on where your 27:21 employees are doing that kind of work. So our big thing is part of our education is you have corporate accounts you have rules about who posts where 27:29 and when and you can accumulate those followers and those comments on corporate sanctioned accounts that are owned by The Entity. Otherwise you need 27:38

to have employees sign is sensitive. What is an endorsement agreement if you hire Bob cuz you got a great social media following and you think you'd 27:47 be an asset to you. Then you have to have kind of an endorsement deal for this. But if they're also your employees you treat them like you would 27:54 an influencer and you have to have documents and place it say if you leave you will then not say this and you will not take whatever it might be and 28:04 it's a hard concept cuz you think you know an employee is not an influencer. Especially in these types of companies they very much may well be both 28:13

people because of their other subject matter expertise, 28:22 but the value of having employees speak on behalf of of your brand is that they're going to be able to get into networks of friends that get 28:32 in in in some ways. Hopefully counterbalance a little bit of the organic a hatchet job that's happened on on some of her main channels, you know, 28:42 I could probably reach as many people if I had a hundred and Floyd's Portsmouth event on Facebook if I did to our to our main Facebook Channel because 28:51

just the way that the Facebook pet like Lori penalizes not penalize wrong Facebook. Elderly algorithms button-front tank 29:00 of what's the absolute penalized if it ever Awards people talking to people versus people bring a 29:10 tool. That's really that that that's really helpful for this. There's somebody call Dynamic signal space here in Chicago. They have an employee 29:20 advocacy platform where it's at its base level is a nap and a news feed that employees. Can I place a company can get into and 29:28

then once they have that that's pre-approved content from various topic areas. So that is an employee. You don't need to wonder. Can I repost this is 29:38 this good or bad? Someone else is already curated that for you now again, cuz there's a lawyer the panel. I'm on The Advisory board for the dynamic 29:47 signal SWAT to disclose that there's also competitive product from LinkedIn Covington Elevate, but those are both really good solutions to help help 29:54 clear up some of those Muddy Waters are around disclosure. Guns and just permission to to repost things. Do we have? 30:04

I wanted to throw this out there to all of you. We have we do have time. So we have a rash we have about 10 more minutes with lots of time, but let's 30:15 take them out his questions then. I'm very curious about rules and regulations about 30:25 employees being given confidential information internally and to what extent they're putting it outside on social media to 30:33 be curious to hear from you who are working in corporations. Do you make your employees sign non-disclosure agreements? I will not post on social 30:43

media. I will not post confidential information because this is a huge issue. Where is internal Communications used to be internal now, it's internal 30:53 plus external via social. I better get that question and I got a 31:03 little bit on the client. So I know that there are varying levels of 31:10 Dino confidentiality Expectations by clients over example of work with a tech company previously and they had the highest level that 31:19 I've ever experienced before I had to sign an additional NTI when I work for this client because obviously they want to prevent leaks. They want to 31:29

prevent other companies stealing their IP and things like that. So I think it is from the agency side. It depends client by client. Obviously the 31:36 excitation is that why I'm not sharing things like things that are confidential for the clients that I'm working on so information about, you know, 31:44 formulation changes our product changes our product launches and things like that and we do whatever we contract third parties, for example, if we're 31:52 working with outside vendors or influencers. We NDA them as well. Amazon other one, that's what's your advice 32:00

for like small business owners or like restaurant owners when it comes to Yelp and getting negative comments on their do you respond directly on 32:10 Yelp to them to reach out personally and directly to some of those consumers or yell to take it. What would you what would your recommendations babe? 32:20 What's the worst they're getting more frustrated as a company because Google reviews and there's so many other platforms for reviews. And so 32:31 yeah, it's becoming less and less relevant. I think doesn't mean that it's not harmful. Right? So you do have to go to the same channels. Good luck 32:41

trying to reach them. In fact, I've seen clients that hire a lawyer and they said that if you don't take it down, I'll sue you and then yelled loves 32:50 that then they post that letter up and then I see this person trying to stifle I've ever seen Shameless really good Yelp went in there now. 33:00 It's it is a problem, but it's the same issue. So certainly if you want to figure out who broke the post you can go through the legal channels and get 33:10 the IP address if it figured it from somewhere traceable and then you go after the person who wrote the post. There are tools that you can comment 33:18

like any other platform on Yelp to to clarify that it's not an accurate review, but generally like any other platform the more 33:26 positive reviews the more action activity you have online the better and it will mitigate any harm done by a bad review on Yelp. I think something to 33:36 keep in mind to and something that we are continually having conversations about with our clients. It's it's it's the criticism warranted so there are 33:46 certainly times where people like to fire off insults because it's fun to bash a brand online and then it gets bandwagoners who want to bash that same 33:54

Brands to and but I think that it's important to consider, you know, is it warranted is this legitimate criticism or feedback? An experience that 34:02 someone had with my company and I think for for small business owners in particular, I think that a lot of a lot of small business owners want to or 34:11 hope to be able to take a more Hands-On approach with being able to respond to that which I think can go really far in terms of making sure that 34:18 people feel like they have a better experience next time or making sure people feel like they're heard in terms of the criticism that they've offered 34:25

of the company and so I can say for myself as a consumer. I appreciate it. If I ever try to reserve my negative reviews for someone who works on the 34:32 on the triage a negative Community Management side. I try to reserve a negative review for a particularly negative case where I feel like I wasn't 34:40 able to be heard in another Channel, but in those cases where I have posted a negative review, I do appreciate when there's a personal Outreach 34:50 attached to what makes more more likely to get that company a second chance. I appreciate you appreciating that being the person who does that we do 34:57

respond to all of the negative reviews, even if it's just Rating we want to know what we did wrong. We want to know if you're just leaving us a 35:06 one-star. We literally have something that says hey what happened? How can we fix this and now it's letting other people 35:15 know that yeah, we've got this bad review, but here we're going to try and fix it and we're going to try and see it. Like you said, even if it's 35:25 unwarranted then it's your still responding because then your say okay, you know, it's unwarranted. I know it's unwarranted but this person feels like 35:32

it's a legitimate complaint and we hear you right you hear you we hear what you're saying. We're sorry that this happened, you know, even if you're 35:40 just telling them, you know, we're going to work to make this better for you. It goes miles unless it's something that's a competitor or disgruntled 35:48 ex-employee. Yes, and then that's different thing that you need to go. And then you track like I have the reviews does this person have what IP 35:57 addresses is coming from how many of them have they Posted and that's when you'll see that the platforms will be more receptive. If you can show that 36:07

it's a false review and that the person was never a consumer or customer you might have some traction and getting that removed by the platform. 36:14 There's there's a kind of irony really with I think in the the restaurant space anyway, like, you know, Rick was talking about a little bit of if you 36:22 remove the anonymity of what you want to say what you say to your mom. Would you say to boss right? You're less likely to say it to somebody's face. 36:32 Everybody's kind of familiar with this right but in terms of restaurant reviews think about that history of the anonymous critic that would come into 36:38

the restaurant. I mean Phil the tell in the Tribune only just kind of recently how did himself so restaurants were always dealing with that anyway and 36:45 didn't have, you know, a direct way to kind of respond to a one-star review by a professional food critic from they didn't know right it existed 36:54 on a controlled platform that not everybody had access to before in the form of a newspaper, right? So it's not new things that they have to deal 37:04 with. It's just kind of new techniques and I think if you go back to intention like you were saying of we want to get better tell us how to do this 37:12

and balance that against like don't freak out that oh my God, she got a bad review, you know, there's there's balance in all of that. And you know, if 37:19 he if you work with chefs and restaurant tours, there's there's a lot of ego involved often and so there's fragility there, right? And so how do you 37:29 kind of you know on the behalf of the marketing team or an agency? Whatever can manage that in the broader context of you know, what a lot of people 37:38 don't give a shit what this person to put on Yelp that kind of thing. I'm glad you asked that question because I have a follow-up question who has 37:46

turned into your biggest Advocate or Dakota. You said you made a good point about how it helps to take the directions to who else has a story about 37:55 that have a food-related story for that actually, so I was working with a company in Chicago that was opening. A new coffee shop and as part of the 38:04 opening of the support that we are providing. We were listening for conversations people mentioning this company. And so we saw a one-woman mention 38:12 the company and she was so excited and she couldn't wait to come in opening day. She came into the shop and realize that the to go offerings of the 38:21

shop were not very robust. There was only like one or two and she was really mad that she came in and didn't have a lot of variety of options that she 38:30 could pick from she ended up picking one anyway, and she posted that she was annoyed about it couple hours later. She posted how she was even more 38:39 annoyed about it cuz she kept stealing about how mad she was she had to, you know, pick an option that she didn't like and she was so pissed that she 38:46 was excited previously and then didn't have the option. She thought she was so at the Community Management agency. We flagged about to the clients and 38:54

suggested to them that they reach out to her directly. See if we can flip her back into an advocate from a Advocate to Advocate and see if they could 39:03 reach out to her. And if a personal message would be helpful and it was so the next thing that she tweeted was, you know company Net never leave my 39:13 life again. Thank you so much in my office coffee taste like a Jackson despair. I'll never desert you. So she was she was flipped and she was a 39:21 convert again. So I think that it goes to show the power of actually reaching out and being willing to talk to your haters. If you have that ability 39:29

if it's a small enough scale so that you could potentially reconfort them back to also use the 39:37 Use the negative feedback that you get from one impassioned individual and leverage that to actually amplify the the positive feelings that your other 39:46 fans have for you already. You know, we saw that a lot in in the crazy cat story right where where are fans really came to our defense in a 39:56 very impassioned way and I think genuinely felt better about their Affinity to what we were doing and then additionally to that like after we had 40:06

gotten that kind of all under control. We we we didn't just kind of deal with the crisis situation. We kind of extended as far as we could in the very 40:15 last thing that we did was we have the fundraiser that we put it out to all of the haters saying hey come to the racetrack and if you bring a can of 40:21 cat food, right you get free admission in a program and all that kind of stuff and you know, it was mostly our fans that really delivered. I'm 40:30 bringing a bunch of food that ultimately help the cats and all that was kind of like where was everybody that said that they were all about the cats 40:38

and they never showed up. But I know that there were other people Within that community that had initial outrage that then when they kind of 40:44 understood and they came back and that very like I didn't realize there were two sides to the story was like cuz you're 300 and so then they were 40:51 there and I don't know that they became huge racing fans, but at least they appreciate it with a family business was doing 40:59 a friend of mine that actually told me the other day they all I get my first big tweet brand 41:06

and he's telling me that he tweeted to United because he is he travels a lot and Sunday night, but not all the time. They used to serve stroopwafels 41:16 with coffee and they got rid of them for a while and then they brought him back and he tweeted a couple months ago like why I 41:25 hate Tom you'll be happy to know what stroopwafels are back and now I don't think that his 41:31 tweet cause them to bring stroopwafels back, but the fact that they went back to their Twitter feed to say Hey, whoever you don't criticize him for 41:41

that before and so he's like a thanks United makes me feel great as a customer that that that they did that so what was what I thought was really cool 41:48 about that is that they took something that was a business boo that they were going to make anyway and look back to the haters from opportunity to 41:58 turn it into a positive story. Cool. Thank you. I think that's unless it's at best. burning question before we have lens 42:05 No, I have you guys washout imbalances. 42:18

Send them to our coupon site. You really do learn we've 42:25 but you know from a lot of us are my home services working that part but you see you see everything and you can learn you'll learn to figure out. 42:35 Okay, wait a second. So you're telling me that this happened and you need this ordered but you don't have anyone coming out to fix it. Okay? No, but 42:45 there are people who come up with these exorbitant stories and you're just like wait a second and it's like we will see if you don't say to your 42:53

things that you wouldn't say. You really have to look into it further go. Okay. This person just wants money. This person. A lot of times will be 43:00 like, well, how are you going to compensate me and I'll be like well for that 5 minutes, maybe a dollar. I mean, so there's a mean it's a lot of it. 43:07 There's a lot of people who you'll come through and you can you learn to see the people with legitimate problems aren't concerned about compensation. 43:16 They're concerned about getting their problem solved and the people who want something out of it or more concerned about getting what are you going to 43:24

do for me after this is solved with that's what I've learned. We can take it if we can fix we can take a couple more seems like there's a lot of 43:31 interested. 43:39 She asked if anyone has implemented chatbots because a lot of people are brands are concerned about trolling. I actually have implemented a chatbot 43:55 before and it wasn't necessarily as a response to people trolling the brand but it was meant to it was meant to actually fix an issue with the Brand's 44:04

website. But rather than rebuild the website the cheaper saw was actually to implement a chatbot which would make the website easier to search and 44:12 it's all great results from it by giving people easier search mechanisms through a Facebook chatbot. They spent I think it was like four times longer 44:19 on the website versus previously the bounce rate for the website was really high because people just weren't finding what they were able to see but I 44:27 think your question if I could answer the other side of your question about concern over trolling. I think that something that we've done at digitas 44:34

is asking our creative teams are the part of our creative Concept in process to kind of tap into their troll mentality when planning out content 44:41 because I think that it's important and a lot of I think a lot of brand don't kind of want That have blinders to what could possibly go wrong at times 44:50 because there's usually so much belief in the products are in the message or in the ad but I think it's important that we plan for the worst case 44:59 possible scenario. And so we often encourage our creative teams and and even our clients to put on your troll mentality and think about how could 45:06

anyone possibly misinterpret this? How could a 14 year old boy missing her for this and put a sexual innuendo and it how could you know Peta people 45:14 misinterpret this and say that we hate animals, how could your grandma misinterpret that's cuz she doesn't maybe understand what you know what we're 45:22 asking consumers to do. So, I think that having that child mentality is actually really helpful tool to be able to anticipate and then prevent any 45:30 missteps from the brand side when you're when you're ideating intersections. We call him 45:38

in your most angry State like I let I call it when I call Comcast 45:44 Think about myself like that and I think about every possible situation that could set me off in a heartbeat and that's kind of where I go from there 45:55 will if I say this they're going to come back with this because that's what I would have done. So to go off what you said a lot of times before that 46:02 we had someone come through yesterday that was complaining that came out with selling a pool float that looks like a swastika but it didn't it was 46:10

literally a little swirly saying I just kind of went around in that was our our big thing yesterday. So because really enjoyed the people and here 46:18 here's where that the people took care of it for us because it was so outlandish that he were going. Are you crazy? What are you where do you see 46:27 this? So it really this case it took care of itself. I would love to know the legal side of this a little bit in terms of the responses put out by 46:37 publicly buy a chatbot like who it was the robots that is great for us and 46:46

is the source so it's not it's it's the medium. It doesn't change the law and I always say that so defamation 46:55 laws defamation law, whether it's posted via a robot say that or you said it then it that's they don't 47:05 care if it's the focus is on the statement. Where was it made when was made how was it published? And what was the impact of that publication? 47:15 There is now this concept of context and contacts is really big part in these cases because if I post a false statement about 47:24

Sears or whatever any brand on the onion that the person reading it understand that the onion is not a source of real news. Of course, I'm sitting 47:33 inside the whole fake news. CNN is an op-ed column and No One Believes that this is clearly 47:43 the opinion of the person who contributed and until you litigate contacts. This is concept of rhetorical hyperbole, which is if it's really, you know, 47:53 that doctor murders babies. That's right or whatever. That's right. So that's rhetorical hyperbole No One Believes that there is an actual 48:02

distinguish. If a consumer or person can distinguish that statement from an actual 48:12 factual statement as opposed to just this outlandish rhetorical hyperbole. It might not be actionable so you can you fight about that. This is clearly 48:21 a chat box. It's a stock statement No One Believes. It's a human being who made that statement disregard. I think about that contacts to not necessary 48:30 from a legal standpoint, but in terms of the communication like if you can put yourself into that person's shoes and not just the kind of the fun 48:39

aspect of sarcasm in a troll and all that but you know, when people lose control or lack control The Retreat to their tribes, right and you find 48:47 access to your tribe so much more easily now online then you could have before so within that becomes an immediate amplification of gaslighting of 48:56 everything that's there. But if you can if you can kind of see beyond some of that remark right away, you might have a better opportunity to diffuse 49:05 some of that. 49:13

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