About the talk
Growth is what every company desires most. In this panel, senior leaders from Softchoice and Deutsche Telekom will discuss how they are driving growth. What are the frameworks and techniques they are using to transform their organizations, and how they tackle the challenges of growth in the digital economy.
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For Softchoice, being a North American Solutions and Services Provider is about one thing: building great customer relationships by making it simple for organizations to use technology to grow their success. To do this we’ve created the most complete solutions and services offering anywhere in North America. That includes the expertise to take advantage of the latest innovation as well as tools and resources to make the most of existing IT infrastructure.View the profile
Experienced IT professional with a strong background in technical leadership, innovation and delivering relevant and consumable technical solutions resulting in the identification and delivery of business strategy. Extensive experience providing leadership direction and accountability for strategic initiatives from concept to delivery. Experience leading technical teams of varying sizes to deliver cutting-edge solutions in the human capital management (HCM), consumer services, telecommunication, transportation, utility and space science industries. Technical strategist with deep understanding of mainstream and emerging technologies including ecosystem platform, mobile, SOA, SaaS, PaaS, cloud-based application design, big data, B2B web services and public web APIs. Result-oriented professional recognized for innovation, driving change and delivering mission critical solutions to ensure bottom line success.View the profile
Every company wants to ride in this next panel. You'll see our house three. Senior leaders are doing that at their companies, how they are driving. That has a dress, that talk about the techniques. They used to use in the growing digital economy. Good morning everyone. Welcome I don't think Naomi fan. I'm a big deal. We thought I was awesome. but, I have a bit of a challenge. Yeah. Yesterday after the lunch break, you said that the session after lunch was the most difficult session. You did. I would argue the morning session after a night
Montreal is a lot tougher to host a moderate. All right? We'll talk later because I got this one. I think we all practice endurance. Last night, dining in Torrance. I may be a bit of drinking endurance, some of us, but we're here to talk about endurance and we have a great panel assembled to talk about it. So I'm going to bring them on stage and get started. So, our first panelist is looks Froehlich from Deutsche telekom. I'm at the light on. Our next battle is, is Chris wooden from softchoice.
Is Jocasta Ava from ADP? What? We're all of the Quest for growth? Ratchet sets with growth. Here, we sit around our board room tables. We talked about markets customer segments, were all looking for ways that we can grow and the weirdest animal the panel today top execs from diverse companies, we have Telco technology service, provider of software company and they're going to bring different aspects of growth and to the table here. And furthermore, The panel has a bit of diversity in terms of their certain experiences without direct. I mean, we've got loads who has been with after x-ray. I think
six years now. And in fact, I think this is probably been on the be engaged stage over the years more than most at direct employees to be on it as well. So we have a pretty broad mix but, you know, I think the key thing is we want this group to share Frameworks techniques that they've developed over the years to grow and really talk about challenges, how you've overcome them. And, and then finally will try to probe some wisdom for everybody was just getting started out from some of the things that you, you've learned over the years. So that's really
the, the plan for the panel before we get started. Maybe I'd like each of you to just do a quick intro. Role in the organization to support the context of where you're coming, from to it with some of your answers. So let's give me start with you. One is delivering cloud services and corresponding Professional Services to our segments or Netflix, how we call them, which is predominantly on board. Partner's life. Cycle partner is into propositions around their offering
and the second rule is we operate. All the digital touch points in Germany for all cloud and Security Services also for those Services, which are not delivered by my unit spotted Trotter units, which basically means we're on the clock for 12, Arabic, all of, which is called Telecom Cloud. We operate the cell service and marketing automation later, and I'm not responsible for the cloud customer care first and second level. Yeah. So I leave Business Development and alliances that soft voice. And basically what that means is we help to form the long-term corporate strategy
and how to execute a 10-year term out to the development of new offerings and capabilities meeting her customer needs. My team also has responsibility for providing all the presale support behind our joint offers with other technology partners and we manage our relationship with key Alliance Partners like Microsoft. Cisco, HP, Google, Etc. I'm with ADP since 2002, I pioneered the creation of the ATP Marketplace and our mission is to create an ecosystem around ADP. And tend to view this
ecosystem in the NFL to different ways, we want to deliver the best digital experience for our customers and the end consumers. But we also want to leverage our partners capabilities in Innovation and embracing it to get into a really good system. So my team build the platform, we on board, Partners on the platform and we make them successful that we collectively going to dress her customers needs. It started with some questions. So so let's do peas have great success over the last six years. Can you share some of the some of the ways that you
drove that success, rice or I would run you over the last six years to think there are four key success drivers on with different shade two more around hunting with the spelling of an omni-channel and delivery service. Rep around the two, others of the third, and fourth one is customer success management and a veggie omelet in the ecosystem. How we call it to it. We talked about about this already yesterday and I guess every company has to find his own setting giving baby the capability what work for us. And actually, literally took us years to
find the right. Setting is develop in what we call an omni-channel. So, we haven't quite extensive Field Force in Germany, but these are Tellico sellers, so I'm not very good nighty. Putting the door, basically for the customer. They might have to customer relationship. And if you give them the right story, they're able to introduce the topic. Then then we have a very specialized inside sales teams, which then baby be moved in into the sales process and and convert the customers by using altitude of digital Health Care in their faces, into things were quite important in setting
up, I'm in the first one is we have no very sophisticated cell service in marketing automation, through which, we basically stearly customer journey in all the channels for the different touchpoints. The second one is we decided a couple of years for Clear, what we called consumption for a strategy. So we basically incentivize sales today. Okay, your task is to get a customer on board You know, even a trial is fine from that we will work on and start converting customers bring other services in there. And then what, of course, quite difficult. You need to talk to a
traditional salesperson about hunting a trial to subscriptions. That's not so funny, but if he eventually I mean, the stupid that's about tails. The second service rapper I mean, selling a solution offerings is one thing. The other thing is really ensuring that customers are able to work with it. So there's a lot of migration in their assistance and then things one of our call different Raiders. Then we spend a lot on building, a very good remote service. And we also have a kind of local
Bartoli with local fulfillment partners and customers 1 service on Prime. That was not so important in the first years quite important. Singer with a 24-month, three, six months, something like that. When we have started to build, significant pain to really constantly be in contact with customers and and develop them. I think, for the it Forks, this is quite natural in the trunk environment. Not. So, when we started, we had the CRM strategy will say, okay? We met contact the customer two times a year because I
mean in Europe, very clear carrier so we sell Service package. And then, you know, you're in for 24 months until 3, we can try to talk to you soon. Walking around and telling the management. And I need significant budget to contact your customer is not only to three times a year, but to three times a week and they will love it because I believe great continent has a lot of money that was easy. But eventually I think it was one of them the major drivers and finally actually 50% of our gross comes expertise was the days every month
which is quite significant. And in the fourth thing is unlocking, the echo system which is something where we started out with the middle of last year, really, to try to build you applications. On top of the existing days, we work a lot on penetrating. The Microsoft, everybody talks about Office 365 and fight. These are at 600 skin was all over self. Can you share a bit more on how you evaluate, these ecosystem products, and how you decide which ones to bring to market? The way we treat the portfolio has changed over the years
in, in terms of portfolio decisions pricing, as well as integration. So, when we started, we just look for talk to every Isley, you know, whether we like the application usability features, think like that. But now it's more like and what we found all, this proves we're not able to sell 20 30 40 different things. So we just released in the hunting fight for hunting, everything threads, were able to work with 5 to 6 and then, to be friendly. So, the big names with Microsoft and Cisco and please forward to me, this is what our guys were able to bring to the
customer and then we start if we talk now to two IVs, it's not so much. Okay, what is are your features more? Like, where do you belong to you? You belong to the environment or you to the sap guys, or to the office, or could be, what would be your natural Partners? You know, where could you integrate? Do we go to get a one? Alone is not interesting. It's more like we need to find other applications work together. For some good example is is mobile services.
We started last year was adding some partners with with timesheet management and expense Management in your all these kind of things, which were there for mobile mobile company, too difficult to sell to customers out applications to Simply digitized processes in a mobile Manor to just, you know, typical at Gold processing, things like that. They didn't have to go to the customer and say okay? Would like to sell you an expense management application. Would like to help you
have to work on it together with a partner that we have been able to do the first processed. Look up and then you can start it. Okay? If we plug DocuSign in. Okay? This is the process for timesheet management, but, you know, we are even better important to drive something like that. I'm surprising thing at the beginning, we didn't care about prices to Ivy's decided on the pricing scheme and we agreed of Direction, and then we had some cosmetic. So that is not 7.37 Euro, something like that and I know if you go, but not what you think in the
second system environment. If you go to the customer service locations cost $5 or 50 II cost 70905 route. 208 very difficult. Until we build price plans. When we say OK, you get a mobile service kit for 5 year old, you can decide in a one out of five applications or are we have to talk with? All right. He has to take his nights that week but I need an application for 494. Are you able to deliver on that and nothing? But that's close to Marketplace and it was alongside Amazon Microsoft Salesforce in Oracle, so you're keeping pretty good company.
Can you share a little bit of how you guys are cheap that? Yeah, it's a tremendous honor to be among that Elite companies. Been to build a sustainable ecosystem, right? That's, that's the last the challenge there that we had. When we started in 2014 and we wanted to build an ecosystem that is Meaningful from a customer perspective by the End customer survey TV perspective. So we looked at this ecosystem from two aspects. One is that do you want to simplify and digitize The Experience forever and customers
that they can come to ATP? Discover find try products and services easily, and quickly, and realize the benefits of those Solutions. On the other side, they wanted to build an ecosystem where we can or more Partners launched over the ecosystem quickly. Bring Innovation, to avoid ecosystem, quickly, we're trying to address the pain points of customers. It typical customer survey teepee would have dozens of system managing their human capital and we know that we cannot be the end of all.
And so, what we wanted to do is to curate the content, the types of Partners type of application that complete the portfolio for our customers. Right? In Lord Of War, nickel Industries. Like Hospitality manufacturing, we actively go seek out partners that specialize in those Industries. Tell them that I delivered a teepee and make it meaningful to our customers made a real impact on. A lot of small businesses medium-sized businesses so we can run that video now and
Is best described as an ATM for your own earnings employers. Use our technology to provide access for their employees to receive their earned and unpaid wages. Is a nationwide bakery that makes fresh cupcakes. Everyday Beyond cupcakes. You also got ice cream cookies, layer cakes as well. Paycheck to paycheck and that's a real problem. What we are dedicated to doing that? I'm taking care of our team and not dealing with System. Since we started to use daily pay, he's definitely stay in an increase in population
control. How much I'm spending on a day-to-day basis sometimes bills are due before payday people do need extra money as a world-class Technology power. My ADP into ATP Marketplace to meet the needs of our mutual clients which is free. ATP is absolutely best-in-class by helping. Please be more gay through ADP Marketplace sprinkles can simply turn on the software and now every single employee can access their wages on the tables, the employees to pay the bills on avoid late and in turn, they wind up staying longer.
Navigate to thank you notes from this individual account daily pay because instead of having to wait until that they were able to immediately withdraw funds from the hours, they had work and they pick up their car fixed. If my dad can really help us to get paid and I think more companies an employer should go for it. Able to work with ADP to help us reach our goal of creating the first steps towards Financial Security for the most number of people in the
country. All right, well, pull up cake. There is a small business, right? They don't have deep, they don't have the resources to afford an HR practitioner on-site, right? They have these high turnover, it's a small business. It's restaurant industry. High turnover employees need this. You can take. This is an Innovative way to pay employees and show me to Sweet Spot. In terms of restaurant industry, we didn't have a solution partner did write a perfect example of how a we are able to see Partners address specific needs of our clients and they bring
Innovation to our ecosystem. And what platform is an alien. The software has had tremendous growth over the last 30 years and you're continually now and looking to transform yourself yet again and you've selected after rag to help you, can you share a little bit about how you going to continue your growth and what your plans are. So this is indeed our 30 year anniversary and the company has evolved to tremendous Lee over that period of time. And for the last 10 years our focus and success has been driven by designing delivering managing
solutions. That help midsize and large. Enterprise organization securely adopt the right hybrid IP strategy or end-user productivity Solutions in this way. We were helping our customers to digitally transform or enabling them to digitally transform themselves. But the truth is the way we were delivering these solutions to customers was not transform. The way we had always been delivering solutions to customers which is represented by very long sale Cycles. Very large upfront transactions, that then intitle that customer to the technology to serve. As for the next three to five years and
is a long. Of time to deploy. Now. The reality is we all know that's increasingly not how our Target customers want to consume technology. So we knew that we had to transform the way. We're delivering technology into more agile. Subscription-based model, the challenge we have, is that our systems and processes have been iterating for 30 years in the old world. And we simply did not have the ability to deliver our business model through our existing systems and processes. So we need it first to technology partner, who could augment all of the value in wealth instead of our existing
systems, and processes. And of course, after racked up a bit. Need that not only because of the incredible experience each rate for the end user on top of what software's does. But because of the ability to constantly iterate, the integration about direct into our systems and processes, which themselves are in constant change. Someone whose work with other businesses, like sauce Choice who have gone through this type of transformation and seen what works. And what doesn't and one of the things that we really appreciated early in our journey without direct with the willingness of, of
your leadership team to challenge us and make sure that we didn't, you know, father comes to some of the issues that many of our peers have faced. In this journey, you talk about the oak transitioning now and so you want to sell software more in his description model, right? Can you talk a little bit about the challenges especially maybe in your sales organization, right? Where you're going from large deals where I'm assuming there's some large compensation that that's happening and now you're moving to more of a subscription-based model and how do you transition that more detail? What
this old world of softchoice in their customer relationship? Look like Me of this old world was built on very large transactions. That would take months to develop. And once the customer was ready to move forward, they would write one huge check for the entitlement of infrastructure. Technology, software licensing softer. He's professional managed services in a great example of what that looks like. In our industry is the Microsoft Enterprise agreement, which I'm sure many people in this room have been a customer of or a provider of some sort. And as you
likely know, Microsoft does a great job of filling these EA's with far more technology than you plan on acquiring and way more technology than you ever end up using. We got kind of good at that and then we would prefer that with the services that would help the customers to deploy in this new world. These customers do not want to acquire in adopting ology in that way, they want to start smaller with smaller groups inside the organization without having to make an enterprise-wide commitment. They want to get irate additional functionality as customers
demanded that or their end users demand it. And, you know, it going back to the Microsoft example that is now represented in this, new world wide cfp the Cloud solution provider program, which gives us the ability to get the customer started. Much more quickly in a more controlled way, the challenge that creates for us going from the old to the new world is that, you know, we have compensation plans that reward, those big bang transactions and we have, but normally systems and processes used as we've already discussed, having to solve. But cultural issues, we hired people to do these things to
go elephant hunting and we train them to do that. We've also have to change the way that we Inspire our sales organization, the way that we train them. Of course, we've had to make changes to compensation which is Very delicate because you don't want to take, you know, too much change of since they inevitably feel like you're, you know, screen them somehow. And then and then and then we'd even have to change the hiring profile into folks that, you know, for two customers in this way to those are, some of the biggest changes we've had to make to the employee and internal experience of
cultural shift is it that you're dealing with a lot of elements in the changes to the sales team changes, you have to make them in the people in processing said Spectrum, ATM provider. And you know who is overtime, you know, it feels like you, you're doing everything and I think realization that we cannot do everything, right? There's a lot of innovation that's happening outside of her, our company boundaries and creating a framework or and possibility of embracing then and could you bring
into the market? What's a big fundamental change that, that we have to go through creating a situation for the consumers? Just like what you saw here with sprinkles at the solution Partners, guess the distribution. Two ATP, two large find basil powers in a teepee, built an ecosystem. Where we have seen a direct evidence of when a client of ours. Has a connection to Marketplace a third party product right there. Tension is substantially higher and that's a tremendous benefit over the lifetime of it up a client
from the architect of the wavy. Think about it, the eye first, the baby. Think about integration exposing some of this capability in an API form where partner can engage meaningful way and build indication that is Tyler that he seemed less and it just makes sense. So you know, both sides of the change, I know there's a lot of change in terms of hobby market, right? We have never marketed vodka product before we building that competency, as we speak and then how do you, how do you get Salesforce of ATP
to Rally around this? How do you drain into there two sets? So they can see this third-party add-on products, third-party products that they can bundle together and we are beginning to see the signs of this bundle concept really take. ADP, where is Salesforce and can go into client site and say Here's the anchor product of a tipi. Let's HR payroll benefits. And now in your industry, these are the 10 V, 10 products from our partner Network that makes sense. They work together, they integrated and it will really address some of the big names of yours.
Yeah. Super interested maybe just a pivot a bit like if you think of your your customer and partner experience is as well, write you need to make sure that I guess you Delight both those audiences right, for Success. So what what it what have you done to really do? Try to drive that experience. You do if you search ATM or payroll or any anything related to human capital Management's, right? If you do a Google search, you'll see hundreds of products, Papa, right? You really
don't know which one, you know, is the right product for you. The one thing that we're doing quite well, now is being able to curate the content when you come to our marketplace, right? So we know a lot about you, we know your size. We know where you're located, we know which industry you are in and do you know the partner products? We know our partners very well matchmaking. You know, we're doing better and better job. Whenever Marketplace on the other side with the partners, right? Partners, want to get to the marketplace as quickly as possible, right? Every time you talk to
a new partner is like, how long is going to take for me to list my product on your Marketplace and get it to your client base, right? And we've been leaving telling them that hate not to fast integrate, right? Leverage, every single sign-on integrate, do the data integration lights? Let's let's create a better integration between our systems and that will that will give you a head start as well as you know from a competitive nature of this with this will put you in the Forefront to write compared to all the other products that exists in the marketplace. Claiming your product integrates
with the ATP and the core systems from ATP is very meaningful. So we've been focusing a lot on the partner journey and automating the journey for lighting tool sets Technologies know how any little kids. Flightclub service to select Partners to get them into the into our ecosystem, completely integrated, right? We are marketing. We are providing sales, assistants in a comprehensive approach to partnership that that we have love your family. That's proving tremendously valuable now Talked about, you
know, that the customer experience a bit in and, obviously, self-serve is a desire. We all aspire to get to, but we know right now there's a lot of assisted selling happening, but we're starting to see some customers have success with self-serve. If you have, you seen self-serve, start to benefit or happen especially again, on the customer development fight. So, I'm on getting a hunting customers. If you have an online share of 20%, Which is actually quite good compared to our traditional business, but probably we will be not able to
drive anymore because I'm actually the cost of sales will be higher than actually did the prophet. And however, on Customer development of seems to self share. Rate is about 60% right now from this. Very sophisticated, customer Journey from position, for example, round for Microsoft we have around 60 custom attorneys with 10 to 15 touchpoint life which we constantly a B test and develop and improve. And I'm not actually works quite well. But we also see it's it's kind of We
come to the other development know, it's not something. There is a self-care interface and then everybody things. Okay now it's easy, you know, save a lot of money actually know. I'm going to need tools to for personalized content and then you need a tire and then you need to manage the dater and then you want to have pots in there to optimize interaction and so on and so on. So I think there is a big opportunity but it's not so easy to live. That's why we have to start thinking about new business models of integrating our partners much more
in designing the customer journey and taking Parts over it. I'm well to discussing into and he like as a chair models with other service providers to think about a guy, can we use Bank on Tempe cinema theater to try, not to go reasons and things like that, so that I can visit something to drive to Shaker system even more. Brakes, Chris coming back to you. Can you talk a little bit more about impact digital transformation is having on the Oregon and really special your customer experience? I guess it's perfectly off the point. Let's just made, I mean, I think we all know that this transition
to consumption in economics really requires an improvement in customer success. I think the challenges understanding what that means for our business and our customers and all the different ways that we serve them. One of the reasons that customer success has become so important to us in this transition, is that unlike the old world where you know, the customer was contractually committed to a certain amount of technology and a plan from soft reset. Deploy it in this new world even though it's much easier to get started and how that happened that more quickly, it's that much
easier to stop because they don't have some cost in the technology. They're not contractually. Do you know require to utilize your managed service is running? But nature in. So you really have to work harder and more creatively to, I keep that customer now, similar to you left, I could design the most perfect customer success experience. I know exactly what that looks like, and if we deployed at the customers would love it and then we'd be bankrupt in too much because doing that at scale and maintaining profitability is really tough. In our case, we had to design an
entirely new customer success framework. As we started to transition to the subscription-based agile model of that, deliver in Technology Solutions built on after act, which earlier this year, under our brand called Enterprise lifecycle management. That's our spring work for customer success. In one of the challenges that were meeting inside this new customer. Success framework is determining of the over 10,000 customers that buy something from softchoice. How we tailor the experience to each one of those customers automatically based on what they require a and how they're acquiring it
from us and threw that all? And I can, prescribe know what the right agenda is who needs to be involved in those touch points with what resources, what services, and start to monitor, how well, we are executing that customer success plan around that the transaction activity that we see through the Opera platform. So that nothing major change that we had to make in order to keep up with the new demands of the customer experience in this, in this new world. Yeah, great stuff. I mean, it's never easy. So let's close out with maybe some words of wisdom and to cash
will start with you. So what are some of the challenges you see for growth and continued growth in the coming years? so, A couple of things a data privacy on it, I guess it's probably on top of everybody's mind right gdpr and lot of changes the that are coming up and we trying to tackle that I can we do and we were trying to going to face it head-on when you have a growing ecosystem and when you have these all these connected farts, right? Privacy and how do you ensure privacy and security throughout your ecosystem is very important, right? We are,
the we are the platform. Lines are discovering these products from a remarkably. Right there is a level of trust that our clients have with ADP and and we're doing a lot of things to ensure that the trust is maintained. So security assessments, putting Partners through a rigorous process, making sure that Integrations are tight and secure. This is Paramount in and I do see, you know, that adds delayed to some extent, it to onboarding her partner, but it is absolutely
necessity. But I think I think that's a very complex environment in terms of the headbands that you know are growing ecosystem will have to face and I'm done the data privacy. We're thinking about ways that we can collect can send it in a proper way where the data can still flow because I think Integrations are meaningful and interoperability is a Jew but we don't want to be blocked by data privacy. So being provided consent management as the future of your platform is absolutely critical
in maintaining that and giving control to the client's. So they understand exactly what data is being shared, how they can govern, or how they can control these data access. Whatever Network that they created through our platform. That's another account complex area that we're trying to kind of face that on, but I see you don't do this in the last standardization, right? I think an ecosystem just like, you don't like you're driving on the road. There are rules and standardization goes a long way and an industry like ours were there many, many players are supposed to have
bodies who established interoperability standards but there's no one clear wise in terms of X of a strength. So can ATP player role in standardized exam with this interface is how much is API specifications? So we kind of facing that had on and trying to the impact of industry in a much, bigger way. Yeah, I think standardization is actually really interesting that, you know, the rising tide lifts All Ships and and and, you know, it's a, it's a it's going to be a challenge. And I think we're still in The Fairly New Market and has things mature. We may see that But
what advice but you give somebody who's just getting started out in their Journey because you are one of the indoors who've done this for quite a while and start start small. And, and really think about a story or narrative was fixed to your business and your strength. Because, I mean, one risk with starting with such a powerful platform near the wreck that for me, when you have access to load of Partners and loads of different size capabilities, you could do direct indirect retailer online and I think it's the trip we filled
in at the beginning that we just get home on board. A lot of different partners. We try to disrupt our existing sales channels and try to be very digital and that didn't work. Only if 50 winds were going to turn around program to say, okay, we will focus on some Partners. Know we concentrate on enhancing and empowering our existing channels and bypassing them that it works. So I can only tell everybody. You think about would really fit for your core business and then evolve from that and not directly think into disrupting. That is one thing.
We've learned within the assistant sales with a powerful customer care of me, everything is about digitization & Friends Action, but they, our customers customers, in the mid-market still expect you mean touch points and it's important that you invest. In very good human touch for another hour until we treat. Our customers are people really like Heroes and and they really good. So they they are a big supporter of the growth. And then finally started early access management Don't have any boot camp. You need to work on that
human element. Chris, would you look back at your first engage last year and you were here in the audience thinking about after act and evaluating and determining, you know what what advice would you give for someone? That's here for their first time in the end and looking I remember it really well last year when we were in San Francisco being in the audience and being very excited about all the opportunity that was being presented to us to transform the business and differentiate from competition by my colleague. Jason and I were equally overwhelmed by what we would do. Next where do we
start a? Cuz there were so many areas we could get started and I think we were thinking through all the risk of getting started and over the last year, our experience wish I would share with you. Now, if you're early on in You know your your transformation like we were it would be to start small. Exactly. Like you said don't try to solve all the company's problems with one solution. Quickly pick one that, you know, you can prove financially success and that you can influence success and get the rest of the company wanting more from that in asking, why don't we go
bigger and in our case that resulted in us really focusing in on how we transform the way that we deliver Office 365 solutions to our customers. And now we're starting to build around that all of the other ecosystem services and in is Viva Mexican lift that house, we're doing that. Now, the business is coming back and saying, why are we doing that with infrastructure-as-a-service Solutions in? So my advice would be start small where, you know, you can manufacture success and get the company and your customers coming back. One Day More. Craig Stockwell look gentlemen, I think you've
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