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About the talk
Gary has more than 20 years of experience as a corporate legal counsel, specialising in regulatory affairs and financial products. Prior to joining BC Group, Gary served as General Counsel for Yunfeng Financial Group and Asia Head of Legal and Compliance for Cantor Fitzgerald and BGC Partners. Earlier in his career, Gary specialised in structured derivatives, private equity and managed investment products at Macquarie Group and CITIC Capital. Gary also currently serves as General Counsel for Reorient Group. He holds a Bachelor of Laws and a Bachelor of Arts from the University of New South Wales.View the profile
Jonathan Macey is a Hong Kong based Art Investment Specialist, Auctioneer, Founder and CEO of Macey and Sons Auctioneers and Valuers Ltd. Jonathan has over 25 years of experience in the collectables industry and auction specialising in the field of European Antiquities and Fine Arts. As one of the foremost and most experienced auctioneers in Hong Kong, Jonathan has presented auctions for many luxury categories and in various locations and countries. His active status for charity auctions have helped raise over millions for many charities that Macey & Sons support over the past eight years. With a dedicated team of professionals at Macey & Sons, Jonathan provides comprehensive services for art investors worldwide, specialising in Art Valuations and Private Sales including but not limited to Fine Art, Antique Silver, Classic Watches and Clocks, Vintage Jewellery and Diamonds.View the profile
Experienced technology executive and entrepreneur offering over 20 years of strategic leadership experience in multi-national corporations, government agencies and high-tech startups. Proven ability to develop and lead business strategy, operations, sales and technical teams. Expert in the design, development and delivery of advanced technologies to meet business, financial, competitive and customer demands. Strong management capabilities with outstanding performance, leading technology organizations. Extensive qualifications in all facets of product lifecycle development and management.View the profile
Susheela Rivers is the Office Managing Partner of DLA Piper Hong Kong, Co-Chair for the Global Real Estate Sector, Head of the Real Estate Group and the Hospitality & Leisure Group for DLA Piper in Asia Pacific. She is a solicitor of England and Wales and also admitted in Hong Kong. With 27 years’ experience in real estate investments and developments, hotel, retail and mixed use sectors, Susheela has been instrumental in advising on landmark developments throughout the region including China, Hong Kong, Singapore, Macau, Malaysia, Korea, India, Vietnam and Indonesia. With a focus in real estate acquisitions/disposals, financings, developments, leases, hotels and private funding initiatives, Susheela advises international and regional property companies, hotel groups, retailers, private equity real estate funds, investment banks and hospitals on aspects of real estate transactions from structuring the investments, developments, project and investment management, real estate operation to the exit strategies. She transacts also on deals in England. Susheela is Chair of the Leadership Alliance for Women (LAW), DLA Piper’s global gender balance network that aims to support gender balance at all levels by strengthening the influence, leadership and voice of women within DLA Piper and the wider community to effect change.View the profile
Scott Thiel is DLA Piper’s Asia Head of Technology, Blockchain & Digital Assets and FinTech. His background in engineering and dual qualifications in both intellectual property law and computer science provide him with unique insight, and deep interest, in the technical aspects of all things blockchain and fintech-related. Scott has deep experience advising clients on all aspects of technology, media, and telecoms-related matters, and has guided some of the largest and most innovative global companies in their digital evolution strategies and processes as they adopt blockchain and other distributed ledger technologies regionally and beyond. Scott’s technology focus is of extra importance at DLA Piper as he leads a number of tech-related initiatives within the firm, such being a member of the firm’s Radical Change Council and being DLA Piper’s representative on the Hedera Hashgraph Governing Council. Through this, Scott has helped guide DLA Piper through its own digital evolution process as the firm adapts to a more agile and connected future by way of technological advances.View the profile
Hi. Welcome to the security token offering panel which is been put together by the LA planta as part of the participation supposed to keep out of this have been described to be here until he joined by some of some of the people we've been working with to help, and Mike is ecosystem are realities of the following to the plenary session? We have we talked about the, the launch of the dla piper have a digital last day of creation and management. Can I use this panel to explore what's happening in the ecosystem? Where we're at today? In terms of the journey search for around, then around the creation
of digital asset, the manner in which this place is evolving on a multinational basis. But with particular, Focus here in Hong Kong given, this is indeed Hong Kong by Fluttershy and weight. I'm really pleased to die to be joined by my partner and head of the real estate group and I'll send you got me or don't come to Sheila Rivers. I also joined by Gary to who's the director at the news. Recently about the imprint School announcements, a few locks and conditioning home contest to see that Evolution happening in
the house who is taking about the opportunities around on us and took my advice and rationalization of a realist. And she will give you intense and really excited that has a different aspect to his friend of the foam and to see y'all was strapped. Fantastic Next Generation blockchain platform that your life has been working working with for a number of years now So, he has to look at we were at what's happening and more importantly won't be up to Unity is around it. That's adding spice, instead of the creation of digital assets of rationalization, in the creation of equity, markets around
that start out with a question to Gary. On my end is really around, you know, your position as a, as a leader in the Hong Kong spice. Instead of getting yourself set up with the SSA in town and ready to actually participate as being one of the primary regulated Industries, it's going to be making this happen. What do you say is the as as future particularly? What was the project he's saying ordering the parts are no coming down in the near future? So I think when we when we should probably talk about two years as a phenomenal and also as a
probably wish it was put up with some kind of financial products. So, you see which is almost as if they were in the result for natural product. And I am personally I would say probably not as meaningful because we are really told me but potentially a very broad universe. Baby. Come, baby. Come through technology. And through questions, I would say in German what product is something that we are still in a very, very, very, very, very good. Next year old great-aunt will be things that I actually in the first, we'll have to be quick but at the same time they have to be good for the investors should buy
them potentially buying them. So I think the way I would say, I would still have some of that in the short-term boring is good. You know, this may not necessarily something we like to hear as technology is product structure, but this is something that I would not be in the universe. Is it is what we'll get them onto a new medium. And once this medium becomes a little bit more thoroughly, understood by all the different people involved in the ecosystem, then absolutely Bring It On in longer-term, but in the short-term probably boring as good as if we what I would
probably end. Thanks, Gary. It said we had that conversation before. I ain't, you know, you know, I'm up. I'm already dreaming about that. The music died. So I have a conversation with one of my partners are not about to stress that says, but you're obviously physically quite a lot in the car and I cannot make environment and then in the use of distressed assets as I and talking lies I suppose. That means, but for refinancing them, so you just to see how it plays out. You stole my dance and this is what's going to be
10 fan of a hedera and the Technologies, the reason the daily podcast joined your governing council, is the reason I have the privilege of sitting on your elbow to manages, send a 10 important, not in the way, you think that's going to be pivotal in in, in supporting the development, this ecosystem. Wellshire. Thank you, Scott. So what we did for the audience, let me just described Adara is a global public Network. That has a governing Council of some of the largest companies in the
world, including dla Piper as a representative and we enable tokenization. We're at the bottom of the text stack, if you want to think of it in those terms and we enable tokenization in a couple of different ways, one is that their token Service as Scott alluded to the Head are tokens service. You can think of as through the equivalent enabling the equivalent of an erc20 on ethereum except it's native to the term service or there's no smart contracts involved and it makes it very easy to just quickly spit up a token. If you will, and in 10
minutes time and have that token available because it's not contract based on our contract, It's native to the platform, it's incredibly efficient performance. It's very inexpensive to to execute these that the use of this token service and it's got support for Regulatory Compliance and kyc and those kinds of things. So we are enabling the, the creation of tokens that are all very similar in nature and function like in erc20 mic on it Syria. In addition to that what we have is the
hadera consensus service which is effectively blockchain as a service, in our case of cash graph, not blockchain. But all it does, is it makes it possible for other networks, other platforms to use our consensus service to put transactions into a consensus order. In the context of tokens, what that means is you can have a private network with all the benefits of a private Network. In terms of privacy, of course, security. Scalability cost structure Etc. That is The Ledger for the token Runs, The
Ledger for the token and it can be distributed and it uses this public network that had era Network for putting transactions into order in. So you, you have the best of both worlds, a choice between cookie-cutter tokens or a fully customized token that can operate in any way that you can imagine to design it, running it in a private network. But with consensus being handled by This Global public network, providing the decentralized distributed trust that is the value price of blockchain in general. And in our case hashgraph
in specific, Thanks thanks man. That's certainly the you know, when we looked at the the legal structuring of security Saginaw from being outside the platform, it was, you know, it was essential that we saw some of those problems and the combination and said the ability to have enough air in the transactions. The EZ roll the ability for the network to have the Skyla Billet either. We didn't have things slowing down impact on the transaction, cost of networks, get busy with his English saying with
some of the other platforms. So, you know it really it is his fantastic solution that we let me see embedded into the core that. Got a platform for a liar and all of that transaction support. Successful ecosystem to you and want to find a picture of a horse. In a field of tulips, you have behind you which has been the subject of a recent, and interesting as a category. It's, it's, it's pretty Nation some respect. Some of it can be very, very expensive. And they fought hard for people to access that is potentially opportunities around
fractionalization to it too and allow more participation tanks with our liquidity issues. But I'd love to hear your your vision Network. What is technology and this means that your industry. Radiance. I open my eyes up to the upload in it in an unusual way. You know I still believe the world is about 30-40 years, out-of-date? Technology and end. This is, this is a really exciting revolutionized. I believe it. I mean, I mean in the world and that they really strongly believe that we were neither Solutions in the art world. And this could be the one. This really could be one of the
more I look at this. And the more, I understand it because it's fighting you to me. I'm excited by it and you've never heard me say that. I'm very excited but you know, just from being an Auctioneer and valuer so I should tokenize something extraordinary is that captivates me is going to come tonight, you down the road against as well. It will be rain in Chesaning, City Wellness, how the market reacts me, one of the things I'm looking for as late as we push forward into into this is,
you know, I got you creation about from United Way. So I'll be there, probably going to see a situation where a piece of art, has a value was a hole but the fractional Parts when sold independently is Penske worth more than the whole one. We've seen examples of adding in in, in in, in early side, real estate projects for the digital age has tried. And I premium to the National weld. Be interesting to see if, you know, the fractionalization fee hikes up late, because of what it means
to be facing without without things behind you there to see what what happens in know, as we as we, we move forward with that potential for a recycle of a product that might be ready. Thinking about what I have to tell you, tell me what is an hour, but it's already fractional. I would you like the whole thing? So we can be interesting to see how that, how that pans out in the next weeks and months. And suddenly, the more expensive books about fractional
inches the base, makes a lot of sense, would attract younger moved on and make sure that it's a lot of between 1460 year old Vine painting, some galleries open houses, but the dynamic now is so much. Younger is such a great opportunity for the young crowd. 235 year old age groups, I think in this cuz where to get expunged about it. Try saying, thank you, goodnight. This is Sheila, I guess. Interested to hear your view on the role of United States. I thought I was sitting in the office today. We've been helping to build this product. We've been looking at how we support the
development of this ecosystem. What do you say the wrong with the Department's? Going to play their first publicity for the lavc ourselves as partners? And because we are Partners, they're going to look for it legal to use music to business. And this is really a business. So that's one the fools have his. Would you use makes sense because we, the breadth of practice areas from corporate and bring it to your technology in the field. You're in myself real estate, every hand that Opera a solution when you're doing something like,
this, might be Crossing jurisdiction. The answer could be one place the manager or the other. Another place, the regular people because people don't think we are boldly and we are not looking at law firms, estate advice and they are looking at the near the Brave. New World, you're going into and we are creating what is you use as well to secure a safe environment. This has to be an environment as protective as well protected for the elderly or texted. And I think we
can. All we have to do this in this world with new language you know how the panels because I'm speaking you know this language is news or a lot of people that have planned for you. Generation trade. You will love to tell me. Yeah, I think she showed it to me an interesting spice. I mean, one of the What are the challenges or gets opportunities? I'd like to frame it as it but I think we've experienced as we've gone through this is that in order to Mike these projects happen. It requires a real mix of
discipline. The wrong with the lawyer, respect is offering documentation, the investor, documentation and all of those pieces that I think. I know it was he very familiar to lawyers in hell for them to happen in a why this is happening in digital format. How do we, how do we get the smart contract with the same level of assurance? That that even though we have a, we have any adult kind of traditional contract, get the right people, who understand the language who will have to be a hybrid of a lawyer, and a technology, expect a
lawyer and a Cota, a lawyer, and an engineer, and a scientist. That's how we are hiring. Hiring a mix of people specific people, this and Beyond this transition period of looking at what lawyers are required to do for your plan. And one of the things you've done is the oldest, which is the company and they are going to do archery. Codify what is insightful world into a smart contract and you need a lawyer to do that because they understand how complex, they dropped them, that the Munsters, The Munsters or dropped an old the consequences of this and this happens then watch and
whether the legal ramifications of something going wrong. So the lawyers know what the courts will say about situation and how he got into a smart contract, is both a technical activity has one. That the legal drive is not contracts. My contract to a side fade back into the contract rafting because you're not smart contracts, computer code by definition of lawyers, have a habit of making reference to Concepts like reasonableness, which I'm very very difficult section. Need to create investment documents that are comfortable. In the first place,
you draft a kicker for the sific outcomes and it is our job to stay in these outcomes. These are the commercial solutions for everybody because we know she started, Let me know for me and I was bringing the old walls and the old one of the old one, centralized registers, what lawyers know how that will work and that will still need to play a part in. This is not about getting rid of the old world and bringing in the new it is still creeping on you. This is where all the time, I texted environments for bustillo 19 bus
and he's coming in. Actually, they are also play in this protecting and nobody is taking a bunch of anyone situation. Bright enough illegals because I was too loyal sitting in a room here with a lot to a cold. I know I've made so I can come back to you on the rear of the car and you know what to use to get from a structure. Establishment into an instructor Evolution to really support is cannabis legal system from a kind of a text back. But yeah well I mean if we look at the
crypto space in general it's still a very young space is not yet gone mainstream and so just crypto infrastructure is is not complete standstill. It's much better today than it was even five years ago. It's still lacking in some ways. It's worse for security token wallet software for example just there's just no very little wallet support for security tokens versus normal. Non-security choked do jholi took his her other tokens of generics Same thing is true for custodians.
There needs to be more custodian regulated, custodian support. Same thing is true for the exchanges themselves. So all of the infrastructure in total needs more support in in total, especially more support for security tokens in particular, and an insert to make matters worse. When we're talking about security token offering these products often if they have licensing, have licensing within a single jurisdiction. And we're talking about a global solution where you have tokens flowing, cross borders, cross-jurisdictions
and then you have a whole regulatory Nightmare On Top of the technology nightmare that you often have to deal with. So I, you know, I think that the there's a lot of excitement, certainly around the notion of security tokens, and the ability to equity out of assets that are historically, difficult to get liquidity out of a certainly, no fight previously a fractionalizing. So there's the opportunity is huge and so there are lots of of organizations and people that are working to solve these problems
or steal. A piper is a prime example that the market is maturing but it's still in its varied in infancy and that represents opportunity, frankly opportunity for entrepreneurs opportunity, opportunity for organizations that have infrastructure or are already in related businesses. That can sort of chart, the path and take advantage of In the, the early mover the first mover and and reaping the rewards. So it's an exciting time for the industry in general. Yeah, thanks.
Thanks very much, man. Like, I actually agree with it. If you need to be nice and challenge legally, and technically, we have regulations regulatory Frameworks 55 country-by-country, and we have an asset class that wants to buy lockpicks a county with no regard for natural boundaries. And it's the combination of that, the reality of that app, that technology and regulation that's a problem. But it's okay when Jimmy is somewhat agnostic in terms of using my phone in the car, but it is
right by contract to deploy on a different platform. Handle that. You can hold up a day or night. You talkin to die from from an issuance from a digital distribution spect you for my custody inspected. That's not your problem. This is a problem with many, a State security tags. And then I think the reality of what, we think that I said some cryptocurrencies Lodge in bed, for the ecosystem has built around a thousand others working hard to to do that integration face. With an email and Gary. So I come back to you, I mean, what do you do? You know some of the hurdles I see as
well, but what are you saying? She was as late as I thought, tap into these. Do you do Capital Market and forward? I would very much like her what month has just described as I think that that show, pulse of multifaceted. And I guess from a perspective Oso, we are first and foremost. I know, it's a digital Securities as in when it becomes licensed in Hong Kong, he is effectively going to be very similar to a lot of the traditional broker-dealer, as well as marketplaces
International Capital Market. We are in the business of facilitating dealing. And that means what, what, what we see as critical for the growth of yesteryear business trading and traded need something. Just to spice up a little bit. I think we also need to update yourself. You know, what else to say? And the answer to that, he's used to dealing with, like, banking regulations meteorism. But I can't discipline. And I think I would look at. That is like the age-old question, it just because you can doesn't mean you should, and I am such a beauty when you, when we look at some of the BS.
Ecosystem on University and answer the question. It is really one of the Hallmarks of mixture of an Angel and really what we are really told me about selling your products and decisions regarding buying and selling and trading this year is really the sto does, a medium will not turn back into a good one. I think of it as a medium, it can be can really go or something has some very interesting addition. Potentially make them more accessible more tradable and in time and I thought you meant I'm cautiously in time. All week, wouldn't even better
investment Justice? Don't come back, come back a little bit back into the coal question. What was disappointed that I think we are. What are the areas where we think the ecosystem of all the digital asset before you really see the full potential of coming to fruition Z100. Harding for structure. Please, please let things like technology legal structure. Probably doing pretty well, as like, yourselves on the other hand stuck in construction. It is nothing that I would be more interested in. These are the things that we do to make our lives easier.
So things like really mentioned custodian, you know, we, we we usually don't spend a lot of time to think about them but without them even a very good investment can. Potentially just syrup without being able to mitigate counterparty risk Investments me, nothing and being able to connect with bangs and trade. And I think All the other stuff that we we we we usually don't think about, but I really do my training experience better, things like all the, all the tools that you could clean and also
it's really boring, but we need them, all the settlement Apartments, all the operations Department, we pay the taxes when we make some money. So these are all things that will make you run from a traitor. Without the element traded. I would probably have a hard time. I really making those both of my pocket liquid for forever benefit and last of all regulations, as well, as a point that you were, once again, maybe this doesn't fall into the category of Destruction.
Do not have to worry about whether they breaking the mold so that that's that's how I would probably. Yeah, it's kind of nice. Thanks, thanks, very much. And I'm very sure, you know, some of the, some of the opportunities, Dynamic, new markets and products know maybe buy alcohol, if any change your name to Children temperature in intensive, you know, the Arts the outer space and, you know, we had an interesting conversation and we sort that finding behind you with it with the artist himself translated through several languages. And I
Eat up from there, different lives of ecosystem that you have artist. You have yourself in our seating is at an auction house in Denton. Dealer. And you having bit, you know, you what, what are you saying to bring any feedback from different lives there that you can share with her? It's from the office about a very straight shooting business. If you see what I mean, in a tables, Providence to beat everything in Cumming. Very clear and neat, and I think this could be the winner.
In terms of attracting as a set of that are in the back seat. Reddy on the younger crowd. Something we really ready on this company doing that stuff. So yeah I said I see there's a few hurdles to get over Bet the provenance of the artwork, the band aration to be on trucks. Fixed price to buy it in the first place but serious, this is opening our eyes a little bit in China. But still with the separate projects and intensive real estate in the world. It's obviously something that vast numbers of people are involved in either.
You know, how do you view this cutie talking offering from an issuance and it's in the secondary Market. How do you, how do you see the possibilities for the use of this technology in these new structure, is to really fundamental me all star. Find real estate is very much an investment and has been. So for the longest time, your people invest in real estate by the loading, it themselves. I mean companies the coordinates on the list of space of mine beats. So
expensive Market, sometimes you you buy real estate because you want to have dinner. Office space for rent. That is one way of finding that house is empty with Gary. I completely agree with you, about access to ultimately, it's creating about safe environment for that. People are looking for shadow. Knit shirt, Lisa's is a kind of shot occupancy. What is the new way of learning? That's what it is, for Real Estate this to happen and then that's all I listen to everybody's got a part to play here. A few things has to occur and like things in 3.
Okay, be safe and secure. You need to be complied with regulations. For Real Estate was held by the primary centralized register. I don't think you can get rid of it completely and there is no need to eat on the way to work more efficiently with the same technology. Whether he's away with you record your HR directly, but at least in the end of the second thing is it needs to be easy. Everything I'm talking about today, he's trying to make it easy for the rest of the
custodian weather races. In the easiest trade on your phone to access valuation information. We are trying to build a easy way. Hyper realistic, it has been hard but this can do if we get as far as it needs to be easier. So you can place a small group of people older than me and Ray real estate for the return of Revenue in a, in a performance of a, of an office for the insurance risk, anything that you want to share the risks, go to shoot that thing. Maybe not even know. Maybe something you can enjoy each other guy and therein lies, the beauty of this concert so it
is about real estate in the economy. The rest of the panel here has a little girl sitting in in Hong Kong, in Hong Kong. You sound so intense that it classes, she was touched on a few items. We discussed real excited but with the US perspective, giving you a bite to say, what what are you hearing people talk about? Of course, we hear about the same assets that we talked about here, aren't worth Collectables commercial real estate etcetera. Having said that, we, we've also heard
some assets that are maybe would be considered new and some steps Spencer Dinwiddie. And NBA player here in the United States is building a platform that its intended purpose is to make it possible for accredited investors. In this case to own shares of a revenue stream and celebrities are sports players that, you know, athletes creators in a general sense and Spencer views. This as something more, then just selling a security token to to a revenue stream and use it as a new way of engaging with a fan base. And it's
so He's, it's a new model and in some sense while it's, it's a, it's the same, it's an old model in the sense that people are investing in in a particular Revenue stream, it's new in its engagement model and that is made possible by the promise of the tokens in the ability to trade those tokens and very fluid. Easy way and end to tokenize assets or provide liquidity, liquidity into assets that would otherwise be hard to provide liquidity into. So I would consider that the bleeding edge
and sometimes there's a good reason that it's called the bleeding edge. But right at, you know, I think it's fascinating to watch what's going on. And especially here, in this case, with Spencer, Post office or other people with a technology in contracts and ability to do things in contract is pretty unrestrained. Unlock some of the regular ones down at some real estate regulatory, you know, City Online, Registry the right there, under a lot of rules and constraints the beauty of, once you're out that the Soto Cano, makes economic
interests within the contract and contracts with a few exceptions, extremely flexible things and it really is he out of the possible Center Countryside Vet, I mean, we are, we are now I just want to thank all of you for participating in this really interesting at all, looking forward to working with all of you and others as we continue to do without it, he got a systems done. Thank you very much man to own and ends. I look forward to seeing you over the course of the rest of the conference on very strikeouts and working with you soon.
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