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About the talk
CoinDesk's Christine Kim leads a discussion on the current and future state of DEXs and CEXs with eToro's Guy Hirsch, Binance's Catherine Coley, and Bitcoin YouTuber The Moon Carl.
LA Blockchain Summit is hosted and produced by the Los Angeles-based blockchain venture studio, Draper Goren Holm.
Fueled by global connectivity, I am dedicated to building healthy, liquid markets and accelerating accessible infrastructure for the adoption of new and evolving products in the digital assets market.View the profile
My channel focuses on Bitcoin and altcoin news and their prices. As well as cover news in blockchain technology, host interviews with top project and Leaders in the space, and general discussions and trending topics related to cryptocurrency.View the profile
Christine is a research analyst for CoinDesk. She focusses on producing data-driven insights about the cryptocurrency and blockchain industry. Prior to her role as a research analyst, Christine was a tech reporter for CoinDesk mainly covering developments on the ethereum blockchain. Cryptocurrency holdings: None.View the profile
Innovation is my passion and core expertise. I have been initiating and leading the creation of radical new products and services for Fortune 500 brands and as a 2x startup founder. Filed multiple patents. Appeared in publications such as TechCrunch, The New York Times, The Wall Street Journal, Forbes, The New Yorker and CNET.View the profile
Hi everyone, I'm Christine Kim. A research analyst at coindesk, Welcome to our panel on the evolving, landscape a centralized and decentralized cryptocurrency exchanges. This is quite the Buzz Bee topic given the recent indictment against bitmex as well as a rapidly growing popularity of decentralized Finance or defy to chat with me about this Hot Topic. Our number of key players in the industry I have with me, Katherine Coley the CEO of binance us just over a year ago binance the world's largest cryptocurrency exchange by trade volume launched. Its American branch
which now supports users across 38 different US states the most recent addition being Florida. Hi, Catherine. We can actually make that forty now. So we also wash in Alabama, and Georgia fascinating. We also have guy, Hirsch, the managing director at each row which is a company that is also bringing cryptocurrency trading and investing to the US audience. Each Horowitz operates across more than a hundred and forty countries around the world. It's us Services last year and they belong to buying and selling of cut their assets across 32 US state. Is that number still up to date. We're up to 45.
All the updates from the start of the paddle last but not least. We also have Carl, Eric Martin better known as the moon. Carl, who is a YouTube star that travels the world educating people about Bitcoin and crypto Kyle has a hundred and twenty-eight thousand subscribers does YouTube channel called To The Moon. Glad you're here. Carl. Paper, having me. Hello. I want to start by talking about the comparative differences between centralized exchanges and dex's decentralised exchanges, which will help highlight their advantages and disadvantages of Carl from
your experience using various Bitcoin trading platforms and exchanges showing other people how to trade Bitcoin. How would you characterize the main features of trading on a centralized exchange versus a decentralized one? Yes, so, I think there are many changes that are very easy to use that are centralized, it's very easy to use. I use some vitamins for letters, training is very easy to use and if I have any problems then I can reach out to customer support and very often. Everything is very smooth and I can tell I need.
So I'm going to like some of the changes in the space and I use them. I recommend them to the followers and and whatnot. I have also used some decent size ones and most recent supposed to be swept and it's been working quite well. But I also have had some shoot problems with sending his actions approving tokens and having like 50 pending transactions that never goes through and then I had to get a headache. I don't know how to go in that sense. So I haven't had the problems with this, and I remember also, back in
2017 that we had so much was an easy. Delta was also okay to use, but I think they're little bit slower. Little bit more. I mean sometimes I feel like since the last station I mean, it's of course, amazing the idea but I think there's a long way to go here and for no, I still prefer to trade on centralized exchanges. And I think that will probably be the case for 2 years, but hopefully we can see more developments and we see the will the user experience has to be much much better
on these decentralised exchanges. And now I think we are getting there already. We've already seen a development in the past couple of years to three years here. But I'm hoping for a living more Speaking to the Future development of decentralised exchanges guy. How worried are you about the competitive advantages that you think the centralized exchanges might one day, a pain with a better user interface at cetera? How confident are you that within, you know, that two-year five-year timeline centralized exchanges, will
still maintain the upper hand over. So we actually only for a wee, wee, build a decentralized exchange. We tried to in 2012 and, and you were trying to do, like Atomic swaps are on top of the piston for a call. With the project that was called College coins that you on your see, you worked on together with metallic before becoming left and started the ethereum foundation. So we were we were instilled, very big on defog it. We think that this is the way of the future, there will be a lot of fascinating project that will hopefully transfer.
Finance but not just allow more people to get access to either either Marcus or to the defendant to transact then and just enable a whole new paradigm of of, of living of a Building Wealth than. And we are. I feel that we are as essential as exchange. We need to play a role in this first by contributing to this project. Helping them figuring out how to make that Future come faster but also serve as this is a term that's been using that industry quite a lot to 7 so that was a bridge
between the old world and the new world and you need some of you need these bridges for people to come in converter Fiat into crypto. Get some education, get some help. The customer support that they need, they might need the way. You know, God called mention there there is a role for centralized exchanges and centralized services Play here for many years to come because this won't be an overnight type of thing did. This is just going to take two years. Cuz you talked about having the old and then you coexisting for a while
and like a hundred years ago when the car was getting introduced to the humidity. I heard that in some areas, you weren't allowed to drive the car above a certain speed and in some cases you needed to have a coarse dragging, the car behind itself. So, basically, he definitely had the old and the new coexisting for a while because people are afraid of Music ecology. And, and it's not really proven been tested and whatever. But, I mean, after while accosted better technology to go over and we're using
cards, no nothing worth it. And I think it's the same with bangs and all these different. But we will have defense the life expectancy, since like, all kinds of services, and I think that they will roll. In like an adoption. I think we will probably always have some still but yeah, because we're far from having the sense to us. Exchanges that are easy to be used for other than like really nerdy crypto people. The majority of us here iHome. Catherine, agree with both Carol and got a about what they said of defy, really being the next evolution of exchanges know the better technology,
what intrigues you you know, the most about this Rising popularity and interest and decentralized exchange, is that we've been seeing as of late It provides the ability to have a transaction early days. So you think about liquidity management making sure the decentralized exchange is able to go out there and get as many people trading on a call to be able to have an adequate training activity, going through the volume go through early days of adoption. So you need to put education at the Forefront of the bill, something people actually want and need be able to advance this product
for some of that. Because you just don't have those natural people looking out for you. Speaking to some of the difficulties are on using a decentralized exchange and some of the hurdles that it still needs to overcome guy. I'm wondering if you share any sort of skepticism over changes that call themselves decentralized, but really they're just, you know, a team of developers pulling. All the leaders of making the trades on the platform work. What is in your eyes? That would actually make an exchange Ethan's Life as a person
centralized. Text Nicole to really understand if, if it's true, it's the code itself. Is is manifesting where it where is representing something that is indeed, censorship resistance to an In-N-Out is, is truly decentralized. I can rely on Expert. I can rely on friends that are experts and and have four more technical death than than me. Understanding if something is it is truly a face on the trajectory of the centralization or not but I don't I don't trust myself yet and given all the failures of all projects that were
in a prism to be there. A decentralised presume to be kind of rocket ships and so on and so forth. You have that kind of the end, I think it's healthy to have that kind of Suspicion to check to ask to make sure that this is a viable project. It's okay to be early adopter. You're taking high risk by going into projects that in a warrant tested. I think we're all. I'm just going to let you know fall into that category so I'm perfectly happy to try things out but I am going into certain projects annoying that I might never sue the never see these, these tokens that
you know, back again in. That's okay. I wanted country. I want to help but this is a high risk game yet where I would say the average investor their there, they're still needs to be a healthy dose of experimentation scale of testing all sorts of attacks and you know, bad actress trying to manipulate these these projects for for me, to be able to come and recommend to my, you know, to, to a friend of mine to family members had go in. This is, this is a good where we're far from it.
Carl, would you agree with that kind of skepticism that guy had just shared and, and kind of elaborated on you had mentioned. You also had quite a few problems when you are using different taxes and said that, you know, centralized exchanges are really easy to use but but decentralised exchanges you do come across, perhaps the lag time when you're using a text on aetherium. You could face very high speeds when it comes to trading. Do you want to talk a little bit about the main issues that you see right now with using sex as well? So
today I had to shoot problem, might I try to, I had a token that I I just seen the one to get rid of Irene want to sell it, and I've been trying for like 2 days now, to sell it. But I have to approve it on you this ball and to prove it I have to do. I have the food with my, my Hardware wallet and now it's like Pending and I have a 46 different orders. Now, there are pending and I'm trying to to cancel the orders, but it's not working and it's not my internet connection is not my computer. It's like there's something there with the fees or something,
but I do want to try to increase the peace between staying in my house but still nothing to it. So if someone to listen to what I should do here like I need to know, I really want to sell this going. But yeah, so that's the big problem. Like I ain't very hard to see you and I tried to start a line, go to read it whenever and there are some people that have similar problems and some people tell me to do this or that, but so far, I wasn't able to seem like I'm stuck with his support for her for some time here.
Very very relevant and timely it just explains some of your experience using both sexes guy. You had mentioned that I had actually tried to build a decentralized exchange and Catherine and I recently heard through an interview actually with the CEO of by nasty C that they too were building. You know, Ed a new lock chain for defy applications for taxes to be built upon any initiatives that binance us has taken either is taking right now, or in the past, as it relates to kind of broadening user experience with decentralized Finance. I know that by now,
u.s. is obviously a huge centralized exchange platform here, but tell me a little bit about your experience, either under the company are yourself personally using these decentralized finance application. Absolutely, one of the main points of Finance e r s coming into the market was to be able to deliver. Super easy way to move their dollars into just relax. It's so being able to provide a variety of digital assets and really work. We're kind of confident enlisting these and providing these offerings. And one
of the things we've been able to do since launching when we only had seven points and continue to expand that Variety in the flavor. So, when we saw the able to get into these, what are the compounds and where people said, I want it, I want to get involved, but I want the easiest way to get in there. And so we've been able to provide that for folks and that's really where we see ourselves as a conduit to letting people get involved. In space. And then from there they're able to launch into
centralized platform from there or I think about that. Like when we launched on different platforms where we saw a lack of liquidity and you've got an adequate dollar pair as well as a USB cheap hair and are able to trade this 24/7 on platform. He done. So, we've actually joined the Chicago, defy Alliance because we feel it. There's just so much energy being put in to take place in that kind of next use, case of cryptocurrency, begin to evolve so being a centralized platform. Because the rest of the world can do
things in a way that's less regulated. Speaking of the regulated aspect of binance us and the time and energy in the leg work that you guys have been doing working with us, Regulators to to get approvals for certain exchange operations, and products. Do you think that that kind of approval and that kind of progress could have been made on the regulatory front? If it was an essential life, is strange that there was a decentralized exchange? What would you
say? Catherine have been the major successes so far this year, as it relates to regulatory approval around for fix change? And do you think that those could have being one if perhaps, by Nancy West 11th centralized? It was a decentralized platform. You're pretty late to the game digital asset Market places in America started almost 10 years ago. I think it was Actually, it was the first time taking Morgan has taken on some of the larger exchange clients and Commercial Banking clients. So there's been some sort of normalization
state's regulatory process but there's still a lot of work. So we actually are discussed in and out the real importance of this framework. Does the crypto going forward to having it not be misconstrued or misrepresented was something that was great. Work of the boxing Association, the Chamber of Commerce. We're very excited about being opened up, which is super exciting for more of the examination process from a state-by-state level to be one that's across all the states. So it still, it still requires a lot of individual work with the states in the state regulators.
Speaking of the regulatory progress that has been made, I do want to touch briefly on the headlines on the news headlines that came out last week about the indictments against the next guy as a, as a centralized exchange operating in the US, did the indictments against the max worry you at all about crypto exchange operations in the US. Did you feel like that was a shifting tide as regulatory sentiment around cryptocurrency exchanges? I think we all have the occasional nightmares of waking up and receiving that receiving a call from. We know, from a
friendly, regulator asking, what is going on with something. But yes, I think we are. We are accomplishing our city Toro has being around for you. No presents adopted, since 2007. And we have been working in regulated environment across the globe show in Europe in in in Hong Kong and Australia right now in the US. So when we look at an indictment, when we look at an enforcement action, obviously we learn, it will try to understand what happened, but we are running a pretty tight ship, but we are regulated
company with multiple money, transmitter, license tears. And, and so on, and so forth. Just, if you're also announced that we received our membership application from funeral. So we'll be able to launch our stock trading offering next year, making it the multi-asset platform to wear that we were outside of the us but we are trying to I was still learn from it and see what were the fact pattern that led to the indictment but we are very very careful about making sure that we're playing by the rules. That we respond to all Regulators with the the
respect and courtesy that they need to support the industry. Catherine just mentioned all sorts of wonderful organizations that were also part of the blocks in association between religious of Commerce and so on and so forth, or we donating our money. And our time to make sure that the Regulators are informed and educated about the space. Before many of them, a decentralized, anything is just a scary word, it's just not. It doesn't compute. So, we need to do a lot of work to make sure that we're not yet. We're not getting a knee-jerk reaction as an industry and
other than individual player but doesn't industry to to some sort of an extreme case of a company not you nor project not playing by the rules. That is really what we all need to do as an Intercity really come together with that. We do I believe in in a, in an improving way and making sure that that they support Innovation to understand. This is the future. and they open up the way for more project, more companies and work more prosperity to be to be a fusion in, in a vertical call anything to add their two guys statements about how you think the recent indictments
against that Mexico will impact have regular how regulatory approval currently is going for the crypto industry and perhaps more broadly even just cryptocurrency trading cryptocurrency assets Yeah, so it's obvious that the markets interpreted this as bad news because we didn't see each other up on the day on the same day. I personally, I think I mean kind of it was always something that I think we all kind of expected that the us is going to go out for these.
He said he was just extensions of in tight so it's not very surprising you but I'm not sure how bad it's going to be. They they're going at the business and she's the biggest one. There are other ones out there, All Souls, of course. Personally I I honestly don't really know if this is going to lead anywhere. Also Kiss From what I understand, what they are mostly agribusiness about is the fact that they believe that, they think that people's hasn't done enough to hold you as customers outside of it. But It's obvious, you can
go to business that they say that you're not allowed to trade, if you were you, if you're from the US and you can't even log in if you're from the US. So I just wondering like, what else can we do? Like I don't know how, how can you keep people from sitting there? So it will be very interesting because if this leads to something bad then this would potentially bad. Not only for others, and maybe even for some defy protocol, don't like these implications because how decent, like, all the actually,
there's always someone behind it. And from what I understand, there are sometimes people behind their patients with more power than you might think. So, yeah, will be interesting to follow for sure. I think that it will be all so actually, maybe even $0.40 with Exchange. Will really good food for thought. And I think good lingering pointers to what we should be looking out for in the upcoming months. We actually only have a few minutes left in this panel, so I want to give a final question to all three of you guys
and you keep your answers short that would benefit whoever's coming up next on the program of my final question for you guys. Is what you think is going to be the next big innovation for cryptocurrency exchanges and trading platforms that you'd hopefully like to see worked on more over the next 12 months, Catherine, the connectivity between education and the application of the products themselves. So there's still a big disconnect basically pointing people to go online and you'll
learn about it. And then here's our product. He got to be bridged and make it even easier for people to be able to navigate these Waters and died in a little bit earlier than maybe they're typically die of the patient that's coming into space because I think that technology is, is in a moving forward to extremely fast. And we will see more and more fascinating project is being built, but it's really nice. Think we touched upon that earlier in the conversation, and it's the design Innovation. It's making it simple easy intuitive to use, so that more and more people can
find themselves accessing these platforms. And I think it's project and I think you can easily see products that were built by developers because no one can use. It is very difficult. But once you get that, that those designers to come in and believing And infantry Viet and and figure out a way to scale design for the point where it's it is looks and feel like, you know, like a centralized out. Basically, they were people were thinking a lot about sand and making sure that the, the average user can easily grasp it. I think this is where the Innovation
that I am looking forward to see if. Now, I would come in and make me to defy a lot more accessible to do a lot more people. The downside with the extra days that there is no customer support. I would love to see that you just sent about the exchange. That is so good. That I don't care that there's no customer support because everything is working. So let's hope for that. Think about it. But no. Yes, I think it's all of our listeners for tuning into this discussion. There's
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