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What is Taste? | SXSW 2021

Jonathan McIntyre
Chief Executive Officer at Motif FoodWorks, Inc.
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SXSW 2021
March 16, 2021, Online, Austin, USA
SXSW 2021
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What is Taste? | SXSW 2021
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About speakers

Jonathan McIntyre
Chief Executive Officer at Motif FoodWorks, Inc.
Rachel Herz
TEDx Speaker, Consultant, Neuroscientist, Author at RSH Enterprises LLC
Dominique Crenn
Chef/Owner at Atelier Crenn
Ben Pook
Co-Founder at So Vegan

Life scientist and business executive

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I am a neuroscientist, professional consultant and speaker, science book author, and on the faculty at Brown University and Boston College.

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Dominique Crenn (born 1965) is a French chef. She is currently the only female chef in the United States to attain three Michelin stars, for her restaurant Atelier Crenn, in San Francisco, California.

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About the talk

Without taste, the experience of eating would be a routine and joyless chore. Taste is an almost magical part of our individual experience because everyone’s perceptions and preferences are so unique; but what IS taste, really, and what informs it? It is so much more than a chemical reaction on our taste buds. Taste is made up of shifting cultural norms, food science and technology, and the art of cooking, of bringing a dish to life through careful preparation and the right ingredients. And by better understanding how all of these elements work together, you can develop an even deeper appreciation for your favorite food experiences. Food scientists, chefs, and other food experts will discuss how culture, science, and technology shape one of the most important aspects of our lives.


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Hello everyone. Thank you for but to be joining us today to talk about something we all love. Taste taste is one of the most universal joys of being a human. It makes our favorite meals memorable. His appointment getting low and brings families and friends together at the same time, however, haste is an immensely personal experience because everyone's perception and practices are so unique, especially interesting to me as the founder of a vegan recipe Channel. When I first started to adopt a vegan diet, we were told it would be Bland and boring. He was thrilled to find that wasn't the

case tool being taken, can be incredibly fun, super simple and packed with the flavors. We lost. We don't serve vegan to the bank account, pump out, a policy to help people understand that sustainable diet. Unless I'm sure it will be saved by some of the same actors and Hostess during to explode Spectrum, field of cooking food, science, and neuroscience perspective, to the table to help us one. Delicious question, what is haste in quick? Introductions without panelist to give you a better sense of who they are, or what they do and how they country is

on. Today's top country of John McIntire, who is the CEO of motif food, what's a startup developing ingredients that people actually crazy orrantia PepsiCo and as insight into the story behind the very multifaceted properties of food including Hast earned interest in exploring house. Impacts of eruption of Pompeii stage and leading World expert on the psychological science of smell assistant professor in the department of Psychiatry and human behavior around University and part-time. Faculty in the department of Psychology and Neuroscience

at Boston, College, and professional consultant original research papers, as well, as some popular science books, they take a shower without the psychology behind pace and how they experienced eyes out in our brains lost by no means least is the color of the three Michelin star restaurant in San Francisco, where Artistry in the community is an inspiration. Australian concept that drive shaft grinder. Motor division for fine. French cuisine headache. When is a reflection of her unique

story and how unique section on the concept of haste, lest. So let's get going about to stop by the fundamental factors. Governing. Our perception of taste and have a science behind taste influence without understanding introduction on the basic science behind tasty. Okay, great. Thank you. I'm so tight is actually many things. It is emotions and memories. It's textures at but we see what we hear while we're eating its flavors and Aromas and my expertise is and how all those things come together. One of the most fundamental level taste is about how the brain makes labor

and the Brain actually knit together. The sensations in your mouth of salty, sour, sweet and bitter, and whatever it is you're eating with the aroma of the food that you're consuming, which is coming from your mouth, entering into your nose as you breathe and gather, that makes the basics of beef. Fantastic sight, John sticking with science from thinking food, start up. The signs of speech is a huge role in the development process. That can you explain a little more about how to sign in taxes food industry at large,

is focused solely on improving the taste and nutrition and plant-based foods. And to do that, we really believe our goal is to unlock what we called the secrets of food and that means understanding the science of how food is constructed. How it's perceived when you eat it and when you chew it and all aspects of the experience of eating food, and for us, understanding the Deep secrets of food and how it releases, this different aspects allows us to do something. We called rewriting food design rules. So by knowing more about how

food it work, scientifically, we think we can create food. That people actually, Crave. In many cases, have improved nutritional factors, Topic for a second about new and Innovative products, which are Reinventing the way. I guess I got it from. You is so still a long way. We need to go in the world. Motif goal is obviously to become a great company but you know, we have an environmental sustainability mission to which is we want to make it so that people can

Embrace eating more plant-based foods which is going to be good for the planet. And it's it's just a really important part of what we have to do living on this Earth. But to do that, the product have to taste better mainstream consumers to this point are not satisfied with the experience. They are having with a plant-based burger or a plant-based cheese or either other plant-based foods and it's not intuitive to them how they're going to get two products that they really loved. So, for us, we, we are trying to figure out how to close the gap in those experiences. And to do that, we

really have to understand exactly the aspects of the experience. When you chew, when you eat, how the flavor is release, the textures that it creates right now, the textures of plant-based foods are often. Disappointing to mainstream consumers and we believe that and we've got a lot of evidence to show that when we understand how to reconstruct the food in a way that allows those attributes to come through. There is a significant increase in liking and we do it with natural ingredients but we do it with a deep Insight on how to put them together.

Fascinating study, it seems like everything from our upbringing to out geography and culture surrounding, not just science can change out the section of taste Dominique. Just how have you seen culture and Gloom different state out the section of taste and intern house food in Spanish? I wish I was brought up in front on the coast of east west coast of Brittany and I spend a lot of time with my grandmother in the swamp, I did a lot of seafood and my mother was traditional French four, other flavors. That cannot be explained to

you that test, you know. And I was adopted at the age of 18 months and and I realize that my family has and has just need to the new test. My DNA was a really was ingrained with something different, you know, and I was awake, you used to them and that's what kind of pick me as a check today. I was going to bring it to 6 years old girls. Panini Club has come up in cinema and, and eats mostly plant-based food, you know? And what, what is Peanut roasting 202a. I was going to say

is a section of test, is ran a shot. That might eat a lot of beat, two dots in and what different different for everyone. And, you know, Ben and I'm sure getting a lot of difference on your recipe and peppers. Stephanie. It's pretty interesting hearing you discussed how your opinion Francis exceptional taste because I guess which is essentially an online platform. A trait. We share recipes online on social media. We have to exist, only as much influenced by what sides go out and see in

London and one Corona, As I Am by what I see on Instagram and YouTube and I think this is stupid because I'm one week will create to careers and stir frys. In the next week will create a list and recipes off your traditional British recipe. The eyedropper thing as well. Is holding it together. Roxy and myself is the fact that it's so big. And they speed up too young. I think we take inspiration from practically anywhere in the road. So I think I think that generations of potentially changing and becoming more influenced by what they say online. At least most of them.

What happened in the past and I think as a result of taste is constantly changing and Flavors near ingredients. So what we can go and see about what we see online. If it's late Growing up in France, but then we're running a restaurant in San Francisco. I guess. You have to soak combined those two cultural influences. No, it's, it's supposed to, but they not just one dimension. What we ought to be open that there is something else out there. So when you learn about,

you know, where you grew up into test, and then you are curious with something somebody else, then you realized it was a test. So what do we do? What I do. That's a big Crane and what I've done to my car is for the 30 years, I've never thought outside of the box and never created recipe to just one dimension. Always push myself to be curious to something that perhaps I didn't know, and, and, and that would help me to understand perhaps other people liking. And I think when you do that and when you open yourself up to

Keep trying to chew. You are also welcoming A diversity into your you own on test of like testing food. So it's been being a journey of exchange learning and Andy said that some of my recipe is what do you mean? Why are you mixing all of this? But when they tested that I can sew, Absolutely. Take a step back and think about an addition to culture. There is emotion on memory and perceptions of Rachel. What does the reset tell us about the connection between food and emotion? The wealthy experience of eating is a

very emotional one and it also brings back memories from our past, our childhood and so on. But what we'd like is actually fundamentally learned. We, as a function of our past experiences learned, what Comfort Foods were with the food from our culture was. And those are the foods that we have a primary attraction to, but we can also learn about new food anytime. And I feel free sample in your case of. So he can know if someone hasn't had any before and like, yourself know, maybe there are not very attracted to the whole idea. They can actually learn to have a great experience but

also from the point of view of the emotional. So you're having a community social environment, which doesn't have to be in person V online as well. And create a really positive connection to the food and then a really positive connection to what you're eating. So our emotional response Is Arthur the primary experience that we have been reading. It even has a very basic level of I like it. I don't know as well. Do I have to confess? I have a sweet tooth pain

from time to time. I kind of returns my childhood. So favorite desserts, like, I guess, Rachel platten, I think it's true that we remember the most from childhood. Otherwise we have that kind of strongest emotional attachment to his spirits are often the most intelligent as well. So yeah that's a great point. So come for him to give us a warm hug from the past as a function of the Nostalgia that they bring with them. And also the fact that they were probably foods that we were served from people who loved us who

were taking care of us and making us feel good, the one we eat them again. We got that emotional response but you also hit on something else which is that the ingredients themselves, make a different. And so the fact that they're high in salt, sugar, fat carbohydrates, and fortunately Dominique. I mean, it's fabulous that you have daughters that haven't learned those are, and they're also in fruits and vegetables to, but especially in the roof line stance. A hit and pleasure in our brain. And we are wired to find those really appealing because carbohydrates and sugars are

the easiest form of usable energy. And from a survival perspective, we need that energy in order to go on and go forward today. More. So, we're faced with a nutritionist, and also that are appealing the taste good. Dominique, is that true? Do you think in terms of the kind of raise them on the healthiest diet in the sense? You know, you know, you know, you know, and I'm looking, I'm not looking at looking at getting them, delicious food, you know? And they

have natural sugar, do you have natural twist? They don't release. The difference, you know us. So you can take a lot of potatoes fried and drink a lot of beer and I and those are all could all be vegan and that doesn't make that healthy either. So, I mean the diet and total is what becomes healthy and you know, we should not just be trying to over classify some of these things. And the other thing about that we should not forget is that Foods got multiple purpose, nutrition is a part of it, but food is

about pleasure. Also, I mean, but I think she does that as like a scientist when I heard her talk about developing the recipes, it sounded like the design of an experiment, you had a hypothesis and what would taste good you designed us. Series of different versions of that food. You presented it to your customers and you learn from the customers throughout salvation, which ones they love that science. Yeah, and if I can just add a little bit to what everyone's talking about in terms of

pleasure and help. So my motto is everything in moderation and also to think about the equation of where is pleasure ending and maybe something not so good taking over. So free sample. I'm going to talk about indulgent food and say, I really want a slice of chocolate cake. So the first bite of that chocolate cake is feels really good. In my mouth, it's phenomenal. It's giving me all kinds of Good Feeling by this third fourth or fifth fight. Maybe it's not so pleasurable anymore and that's when I have to ask myself if the pleasure isn't there, what else might getting

from this? If it's not something that I value maybe I should stop. So this one is also goes into the idea of being Mindful and a very explicit. Way about what is the experience of having well, I need something enjoyable. Is it something valuable? Is there something good for me? If I want to keep going Sucks to the whole idea of understanding taste and understanding food and nutrition to be able to make really good choices by saying I might want to have a bite or two or something, and it's a little Indulgence eating. A lot of it is not good for me, but when

you're eating that first bite or so, if you're really are starting to get into understanding what drives pace, you're going to appreciate the creaminess of that frosting, the release of the of the Coco, in the chocolate cake or whatever you're delighted. I think that, you know what we're talking about is understanding, Chase will make that more pleasurable, and maybe make it easier for you to understand, how to enjoy it without eating. So much of it. Because you agree that the

way people see faces of some very unique to the individual rights examples, of some people might be differently and they might find it easier to do not see that cuz the reward where some people might be wide differently lyrics and I would I will find it easier to come to stop themselves. Which is that I was kind of hard that you kind of need to pray. Hata for people who are protrusion completely different ways. Yes. So you're heading out, a bunch of really good points there. So the first point actually is the degree to which you are set up, someone who

is wired for pleasure and also someone who can't stop themselves. So if you're really wired for pleasure and you're someone has a hard time resisting that that's actually going to be under. That gives you more difficulty of the other thing that you just mentioned is the idea of how he's very. So I'm sure people know the fact that people are what are nontasters? And that's actually all genetically determined that doesn't have anything to do with something that you learn. So it depends on your taste of the tivity. I actually have double the taste buds are approximately on your

tongue, as someone who's a nontaster and taste of her kind of the Goldilocks in between. But supertasters actually find that a lot of sensation and their mouth is sometimes too much, so they'll prefer things that are a little less creamy. A little less spicy, a little less sweet. So Less bitter. So that's actually something that's just fine snow. Approximately about a third of the population and then you have people that are on the opposite and who are nontasters, and they can tolerate a lot more extreme than patient because of the fact that they know don't usually, get as much

bang for their Buck. Depending upon what they're eating as interesting actually, Dominique. Maybe you have something to say about the most shots are actually supertaster. I do know of one Chef who is a molecular opposite direction. The most chefs are actually supertaster. Just one question. Where someone a human? Dentist, domitrovich hot for the Seas is something that we are in there. So the basic tastes opponent like supertaster nontasters, that's genetic, but I think

everything else is taught. So I think that you can learn to, like, even if presentable so, nontasters Atari supertasters, do not like spicy and Patience by much because it burns. So, if I were to just put some chemical in your mouth that produces the same station of burn from food, like that gives you burn food and have the food in a social context and that person is probably going to enjoy it very much. As long as it's not too strong so people learn as a function of their social

experiences, their emotional experiences with food, how to like different flavor profiles and even independent of what the Natick star. As we are experiencing I think we've always been passionate but I think so then really nice if this to Newfound passion to restudy flavor in and try to contact combinations. You could apply to food so that you know, I just My place. I get me my life. Do you think this emotional attachment for a safe area to find me Foods? I do think it's, we mentioned earlier than what you were learned. You

learned his comfort foods and learned experiences, often create a standard, what? You're always comparing things to me, personally, if we really want to promote more of a plant-based food diet for people, I think they have to create new food experiences and plant-based food. Instead of my company is trying to help. Other companies make that are plant-based, burgers and cheeses, and no. But I think that's this much of the opportunity. I think the bigger part of the opportunity is to make new plant-based food. It might be

driven through plant proteins or other ingredients in create new experiences because I think hardcore meat eaters are going to it's going to be harder to get them to move over. If we create a new experience that it's not compared to. I think that has a greater opportunity of penetrating into more mainstream consumers and so I think that is a really critical part of things. Yeah, absolutely loves her partner with Dominique on doing that for sure. Especially with plant-based Foods Basics, so many opportunities, but you're staying just experiences

are the industry's concerns is still a long way. We need to. Let me give you an example of something. We've been playing around with here which is the product of a lot of people love it. A lot of people hate which is tofu, Scott, texture issues and some people really love some people really hate for an extracted. Bean curd is quite healthy products and it's good for the environment is not much processed. If we can learn how to change the texture to meet different people demands or different flavor profiles and even shaped differently than it

is today. Good that the base of what is a tofu or another bean curd type product key or a platform for creating a whole new series. New expectations, the new experiences for your point. That ingredients are great. I think there's got to be a way to present it to people in a way that makes them like, exploring a new experience really important, which is littered. The shores of the beaches here was only suitable to feed the prisoners and slaves. And a fact there was an Insurrection about how this was cruel and unusual punishment. And today lobsters are gourmet food at

an Indulgence and expensive and so forth. I'm so the idea behind what food is is a huge driver for how people are going to receive it. If you categorize, the food is gross burn in the trash food, or whatever. The case might be, this isn't something that I eat. If I'm a mediator, I'm not going to go there, then it's going to be really hard to climb over that barrier, but if you categorize Different, like an Indulgence, something really desirable something that's high-end, can you create a whole new set of concept? And I think a lot of appeal If

you need anything. Because one thing we find is there always a person you can change the song. People touch has less. People have to do at home. The more time, they can spend, you know, enjoying the process of picking, I think that's really important that people are spending time. Do not necessarily finding out in the kitchen but spending time actually doing something they love which is you like reading a plate of food into sharing with the family, into this idea of eating

with your eyes. So you your food looks incredible. And I think the visual presentation of foods taste I don't think of myself as a chef, you know, I create experiences with people and I like to create a dish with lot of different components that each has a special meaning. You know, I can give you a full when I asked on the menu called what in the forest and Was it was, it was kind for me my chance at a creative dish that to the story, the story of my childhood and an end to the forest with my father and the end and my brother, and I

was going to the forest picking up, wild mushroom, wild berries and and it was very visual is when you look at it as dumb as you walk into the forest to text her and that I used was also the lettering of flavor and tests that went to do bread is usually take you to the time and place where you want to tell us. And this is what we do actually plan. I'm not just getting you a plate. We screwed up. I'm really I'm supporting you to the time and place where I want to tell you the story. So I think it is also mine and

someone can come here. Don't have the same experience or don't do anything by myself but that might be a story or an Android replaced in the mood. And when you do that, you will to invite people to your world that had some their World War II, and then the rest is history. And that's how we will test. And I think Rachel, you can, I've seen these connection about the usual and taste and smell and texture. I seen you, when you were together, you private Say something. It's an amazing experience.

This is about to make me cry, remind me. You're going to make me cry because I'm thinking about experiences like a from my childhood like, with one of my parents and remember, eating a food special events and that just brings back those memories and the memory of the food is so vivid, like, you can. I can remember the food almost more than I can remember the event. I asked you to do story. So I wish every year at unique Ryan and that was at school to Brennan seed and the lady

from Russia and then she did but she remind me of eating my grandmother in Russian when she was doing this drop and we stand memories and you tell the story and the story is connected and she's going to cry right now. Aroma is the most evocative of emotion and memory at any of our sensory experience labor which is aromatherapy So, I completely understand that experience of that person, feeling transported to their child, to their grandmother, and the overwhelming emotion that comes with that, the emotion is actually the primary Innovation that we have when we smell something, it is because the part

of the brain that processes the motion is the same part of the brain that processes. Unlike any of our other senses, we have this really unique and a deep connection to the emotional quality, much more so than to the linguistic or the descriptive and so far. So it's just really deep personal experience. We have when we have flavor and we have a rama eating it, Rachel. Rachel, does that also work with a version? I can remember hearing that if you got sick and you were eating a certain kind of food that memory is sensually, triggers you to almost get sick. When you eat that

again, it takes years and years of not eating that food to be able to reintroduce it without getting sick as I think that's true. It's called to learn Taste of Burden, although it's really flavor and it's really based on smell because you don't have an aversion to all things that are sweeter, all things that are salty, you have an aversion specifically to that one dish is actually adaptive because it's what you didn't, you don't want to repeat that mistake again. But the thing is that it was just sort of an accidental coincidence. Like you happen to get the stomach flu

on the same night as you had some new food. Let's say we're even through that. You can eating before as a function of the fact that you got sick and eating it, you were going to avoid that food for years and years. And I have a personal experience with pepperoni pizza. That's like that. And it's taken actually, my husband taking me to a zillion, Red Sox games at Fenway and finally, getting me to have a slice of pizza again, that I've kind of gotten over the immersion at least when I eat it. But when I think about it, it still no, not like you to have a slice of pepperoni pizza.

Atomic. It's really fascinating to hear your perspective on to storytelling behind. You is kind of fascinated in transit city stories that you create with your food at 8 kind of Timeless in the sense. You know this plate of food will still be on your menu for new ways to kind of tell that story. You know, if I have the seven-year-old that I will be involved If he, if he, if he's home. So, you know, traveling and meeting people and and giving you experiences of do a lower price to create a new story. At a time.

When I was trying to read a stinky bug, my own story and, and expenses and that he knows who my childhood with my parents and, and, and so far for the last few years. Specially, you know, last year, I really wish of yours on the time and place where I was a lot of history and test and and and and any different each year and usually when you are on, this is very important that I get there and that's what is too important to be a friend because I like to work like the word infer a book Evolution

and and shine Genie know where that you're changing in the world because you want to learn something else, you know, I just have a question about. I've been having this number 84 for the past 10 years. What do you do for me? What do I do for you? Well, I I will ask you to trust me and and and to bring you a tray that wields a new way of doing it. When you talk to me, you got to trust me, you know, but what we trying to create your, what do you have that, you know, the experience, you

know, our people that comes to the years You know, and I just customer that has been coming here for the last ten years and I've never been disappointed. And thank you so much for putting me up to you experiences and I think I think that's what John was saying that experience experience has a very important and you know what? That's who we are. And that's why I wanted to continue to be as a chef, you know. I think even with a new experiences, their design cues in the food that gets connected to other experiences. So I

must be like a revolution, you're going to sing her or text her attributes that you like and then connect a different things. And I think it in ingredients, that, you know, and love. So it's Evolution isn't like we're here. We're on our way over there, it's over here, and maybe a little over here is our little over here. So if that's what evolution is, it's moving slightly over those different things into your point, Ten Years Later. This customer went from here, all the way to hear didn't realize it was kind of moving in and try and make things right.

Rachel, what does the science that has in terms of do we get ahold of having the same thing over and over again? I do we kind of crazy with these new experiences when it comes to taste, Isaiah on the other hand is still kind of enjoyed ice. I grew up eating as a child at the same time. I am at new things. I want to sign in. The song is actually says that. We crave what we eat. So if we are, you know, someone who has a certain, let's say chicken wings in their diet on a

frequent basis and you're going to be a chicken wings because that's something that's in your diet. Maybe it's something that's a bit more indulgent, but it's something that you will want. If it's something that you need, in fact, there was a kind of a shocking. It's that he done with a nutritional supplement on sustacal which is one of those Complete Nutrition drinks and people were forced to have all their meals of just us to Cal for a whole week and during that time, no Cravings, brother food. But then after the study, people were asked again, what kinds of foods they were craving prior

to the study and during the study no one ever said sustacal, but after some people actually said, they were craving celestica. So the idea is that we do crave, what we are consuming, but then it also happens to be that certain foods from our paths will be Even if they were special busy, haven't had them for a long time. Will create some again, but you create cravings for new things. We have to create the idea that we want anything. So I think that was very important to have the idea be exciting. I was just having a

question about training is to ask you soon a woman that is pregnant. Open at 12, something that they never cried before. So that actually seems to be more folklore and it go that, I mean, it hasn't been studied and any systematic way with respect as business but it has been studied with respect to taste and smell. So, one thing that happens when your pregnant actually is your sensitivity to Bitter increases a lot and that's important because bitter things other than the healthy leafy greens in

nature are often oil or poisonous and so when you're pregnant you want to make sure that you're not consuming poison, that would be very dangerous. So bitter taste. It turns out. However that even though it's a lot of women, stay at their sense of smell is super, super strong, hasn't changed, but their attention to smell has really changed. And I think that there's so many things like a logically going on when you're pregnant, especially first pregnancy. Is that the idea about certain foods can become either repulsive just because of you in your own head or really

desirable and you might save All kinds of strange things and then be with, Auntie eating a bunch of other things that you used to enjoy. And I, I would say that that's primarily psychological and all the things are going on in your mind, while your pregnant. Unless so, to do with actual taste her say, Back to the tube and your point about going back to craving what you like and then creating a new experience. I think some of that goes back to the whole idea of eating with your eyes and creating a new experience, think about the

design attributes of the packaging in the presentation and then how it looks on the plate. All of those things are really a great way to start getting people to be attracted to a new opportunity. So that's when all that visual cues really make a difference. And then to Rachel's point right after the visual to come, see a room with you. And if you can get those two together, you can start moving people to new experience. And I think that's a real critical piece. is John from, I was going to say, even the color of the plate changes, how

you might say, something know, the color of the plate, if it's make something look, anchor, or red, or people could actually perceive that as being sweeter, and it would be made people receive it, and that makes lots of being more. Salty sow visual things can see, both the attractiveness the plating and actually also changed the perception of economy. Works in beverages red beverages people as they perceive as much sweeter than others. Jonathan Spector. Do you think it's the controversy at the my when I guess it is

kind of naming rights to use the same as you would name like a beat bug. Is it important that people have a familiar kind of names associated with a put on? Put on face kind of industry Minister. Maybe rainbow Newton's new experiences going to get people into the face. So I'm probably assuming that one of my advisors is going to watch this. Who has been constantly telling me that that is a big deal to get people to the name these things different way. I because if you have a burger eater and you keep telling them that, that is a burger and it's not going to meet

there. I, we always call it the concept of a burger but it doesn't create the Fulfillment of what your experiences expecting. But I think it's going to be different for different people and different types of consumers are poor people, what they're trying to get out of it. If you're a vegan and you're with your idea of a Patty that goes on a sandwich, is Veggie forward with protein but it's not Burger like you're probably be happy, being it renamed something else but if you're trying to get another consumer that says like I love burgers and I think I'll be willing to eat a plant-based

burger if it gets closer and closer, then you're going to probably going to use the name. Includes that connect to what they're expecting. What I think there's a big tent and we should try to be able to accommodate everybody under that think that I think we're going to find is different people like different shoes on naming and it depends what you're trying to get out of it. I think all of that is a possibility and I don't know that we have to judge it.

What are some of the biggest misconceptions, misconceptions? Oceanside taste, the food industry perspective. Wow, where do you start? Well, I think one of the ones is two people change their preferences and the answer is, yes, they do is learn. It takes one of my great examples is up from my past is the people that drink Beverages and what let's use the soda is an example. Most people drink. You're so does a new generation of people came up and started moving over to diet beverage has

and when they started drinking those get a lower calorie diet beverages. They notice the change different but they then adapted to that new that new lower-calorie type of tape. It's a different taste profile, completely, if you give them a full sugar soda, Oh, my gosh, this is all terrible switch. I think one of the biggest reception issues and I wish I had a more positive example of a food. I mean, nothing wrong with the beverage, but I think we can get people to adapt to New Taste and I think it is, is an important part of not

getting forced into just the same food products. So taste can evolve. I love how Dominique us about evolving and lots of ways. I think people's ability to chase, then go after different things evolve site, I think that's pretty cool. Same question, I guess from the science perspective, what do you think of some of the biggest misconceptions when it comes to taste? Let me see, the biggest misconception is thinking that it all comes from your tongue. And really, most of it is coming from your nose. So, for example, if you could

not smell bacon would just like salt and apart from the texture, you wouldn't be able to tell it from something else. So if you had an apple and a potato and you couldn't smell, you would not know what you were eating. Your eyes were closed and you can try this at home. Just like your nose and eat something, and then have your relation vassals, and you will get a huge surprise. How much insulation is brought by smell, which is what flavor the other really interesting. Part of that is when you can smell or taste the stealth get stronger. So if it's sweet this week, get stronger

with the smell. So, the intensity of the experience of eating is really, really a lot about smelly. People don't realize Just to add on to that. I also think that all the different components that lead up to the experience can Cloud each other. And I want to example from Just last week here in our laps, we were tasting some plant-based Patties or Burgers, whatever you want to call him, and that we had two different flavors systems and I kind of was looking at the first wave and I was commenting that, you know, I think the texture is not quite right either.

And then the next product came in and the flavor attributes and the appearance were better and I immediately prescribe better texture to that product I guarantee you, I was confused. The texture was probably the same because I think we can't always separate all the different components and, you know, we haven't talked a lot about texture texture to me, is one of the biggest issues with food is the texture immediately. People have an expectation higher about texture and when they don't get it, it's one of the most satisfying things people get is

over textures off. So I think I left another component. thinking about, 100%. That's one thing I do. Miss point is, I think, from a home cooking perspective Wilson, especially with Pompey Seafood, we have exceptional there is a perception that I can be quite complicated. I think, one thing we try to do something is really try to inspire people to cook with minimal ingredients with three simple message and just a cheap ingredients of plastic play the combinations in trying to take like 10 minutes in a

NuWave and displayed it, took them in a new way for sending you away and you do use those simple cooking methods to achieve the results. We're coming to the end of Espinoza. Thanks so much to everybody, a very different fields for everyone to have a better understanding of paste and was ultimately on the line. If we don't have a healthy curiosity of taste, Everything emotion. And that is old for me and I think we need to put so much. We need to put so much more and more. I see me to science and understand how it is expected to

affect us as human. And I'm going to is doing and also text you such a meaningful aspect of our life and to understand it better. It's too important for the advancement in the food industry today. So Very well. Said that Rachel. How about you? Well I think of you as you said at the beginning eating is one of the great pleasures of Being Human and in order to both have it pleasurable, valuable nutritious animal. We have to understand what it is that we are tasting and so it's a fundamental key to both our future of

food consumption, but more than that, the future of the planet, How can I develop a project can work with Rachel and Dominique on together? Cuz that would be awesome. We will for sure. So I want to make it simpler. I think you appreciate when you decide you like something and you learn more about it. I think the crate greater appreciation, you know, you ever notice when somebody like the sides, they like wine and then they start reading about it and learning about it, they want to talk about it, they want to call. I think there is a component of learning and

understanding the underneath of it, like, cooking, like others that creates greater appreciation and we have a great appreciation for food. I think what we at we end up really understanding and thinking more about the importance of that food, where it came from, what it does to me if my it might be personally. And if all of us spent more time, thinking about that, our health would be better. And if you thought about how it was made and develop, our environment would be better if we need just to get that are on that, that would be awesome. The lake. I think it's

time to rock. Pop. Thank you so much to everyone watching a real panel. What is paste is an incredibly exciting time in the food industry right now. And hopefully, this time it was given you a deeper appreciation of how taste Thank you.

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