Margrethe Vestager is EU Commissioner for Competition. She previously served as Minister for Economic Affairs and the Interior (2011-14) and Minister for Education (1998-2001) of Denmark, and as President of the ECOFIN Council (2012). She was Political leader of the Danish Social Liberal Party (2007-14), and has worked for the Danish Ministry of Finance (1993-95). Ms. Vestager holds an MSc in Economics (University of Copenhagen).
Amy Jean Klobucha is an American lawyer and politician serving as the senior United States senator from Minnesota.View the profile
About the talk
Beyond privacy, revised liability laws can hold companies accountable for what they disseminate online. Antitrust actions could check the flow of wealth to the small number of companies that control platforms, aggregators, and algorithms. A lightweight horizontal regulation could add a safety layer to the high-risk applications of artificial intelligence. This discussion will focus on the role for technology companies in the 21st Century and what a new "social contract" could look like for Big Tech – in both Europe and the United States.
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Hello, everyone. And Tristan Harris, president of the center for Humane technology. Normally I would say thank you all for coming. But instead since we're all virtual, thank you for tuning in. I spoke about the need for a new agenda for technology and I'm sure many of you have also watched the film at the social dilemma, which details many of these arms. I think many people are now waking up to the reality that we need a new agenda for technology and that surveillance capitalism. As a business model, does not protect democracy or the people's interests. And I think we saw that on January 6th,
the results of the unregulated process in which social media rewarded, the most divisive messages, the most narrow extreme realities that got narrower and narrower culminating in the events that we saw January 6th. So we have a very different set of reality that we are now living in. And this is because big Tech is largely an unregulated market place where companies make more money. The more they allow unchecked messages to go viral for the most clicks or for the best price and we talked about the tech. We have to realize that we're talking about an entirely new species of power. We've
never really seen this before. These are Urgent issues, people have blown up cell towers because of the misinformation that they have seen how we are seeing vaccine roll out across the world, inhibited by some of the misinformation that's being spread. And I think it really proves that psychology and what we're keeping into leaving. I Dental in spy technology is even more important than the science of even having the vaccine Democracy is facing a crisis of confidence. We also have state actors with money, can essentially pay to destabilize democracies while we obsess about protecting our
national borders. And if you know, Russia or China were to fly a plane or a bomb into Europe, they be met by NATO or the Department of Defense but when they're flying and information play more information, bomb into United States or Europe met by a Facebook algorithm, the white glove that says, which zip code would you like Target? So platforms have not taken sufficient responsibilities and taking over the Public Square. And are we going to use today to make a statement? Or are we going to use today to make a difference? I'm incredibly excited by the panelists that we we have here today.
We need regulation, we need better guard rails and I can't think of a better group of people to be discussing this, in my view, the only way to turn this machine around is with massive public pressure and public understanding. And so, with my great pleasure to have to be part of this conversation at South by Southwest today, I'm going to turn it over to Anne-Marie and cost Larson who's been Mark, stack Ambassador, and a Pioneer in Tech plugs be for introductions. Thanks. What it will take to move from the
subcommittee for enter truck competition. Which women are leading the charge and redefine the influence and the power of six packs. Both the United States and in Europe. Senator Klobuchar, let's meet at start with you you will need an invoice on. And where do you see the challenges in relationship to Big Tech and antitrust in the years to come? Well, thanks so much and Marie and hello everyone. It's great to be back for a chill day at South by Southwest, thank you Kristin, for those insightful remarks, I was actually thinking back to when I was there last time and
the focus that we had. I think many of the speakers were ahead of their time to focus on looking at data, looking at the algorithms trying to do something finally, and put some regulations in place on the social media companies and forging a social contract with this. The subject today with big text is truly a global project and a discussion wouldn't be complete without the perspective that Executive Vice President that are princess and I thank her for being on as well. I talked to her a few weeks ago, and there's a lot of coordination,
all that must happen. As Tristan mentioned, we're living in an inch How to bleach a challenging time in our nation's history, we have hundreds of thousands of Americans in our country that lost their lives, to coronavirus affect global, pandemic country struggling, all over the world. And then we had what happened in the US on January 6th. When literally, we had an Insurrection and angry mob stage and Insurrection on our Temple of democracy had the US Capitol. And yeah, I felt as one of the people in charge of the inauguration two weeks ago, that it was so important to
reclaim that stage. We literally were on the platform where these insurrectionists had spray-painted. The bottoms of the khans, you can still see it on the Marvel has broken all the windows that we fixed President Biden and vice president. Harris, were inaugurated on a beautiful sunny day and as I said, and I know many of us feel this way, all that it was that moment where our democracy picked himself up and dusted itself off. And went forward as we always do in America as one nation, under God, indivisible with liberty and justice for all. And a lot of what
must be done. Now, is to channel is so important that rebuild our relationship across the world and it has to work better with countries around the world. And it is to tackle the issues of our time. And we all know that one of the major issues are where we just have not seen the progress that must be made in. America is Big Tack and that means everything from something I discussed. Last time I data and privacy is it also means doing something for our information. I actually watch with 4 as what happened
last few weeks in Australia, where there they were, simply trying to make sure that the content producers that journalists were compensated for the work that they do. I need internet and Google and threatened to literally take down their platform in that country, which of course is a major threat. When you've got a monopoly with something like, 90% of search engine, that's what's happening right now. And since our last discussion at South by Southwest, it's even gotten worse. We know how
incredibly important. These companies are important events during the pandemic, and it's not just as we know in Spokane Valley. Tech companies, have created, all kinds of opportunities, frog, connecting with friends around the world, be a video called first graders learning how to use the mute button people. In remote areas before the pandemic and now being able to his boat with their doctors and experts think it was a look at x-rays. These technologies have transformed our lives, but there's a downside if the government is
not any kind of a counterweight to making sure that the technology is used for good and not bad. And it also must be a ton of weight when it comes to Monopoly. And I went, you seen in the tech area is something that literally is unheard of in our country, have to literally go back the mabell, which was eventually broken up to see anything like that and the root of the power, of course, lies in their ability of a few companies to dominate markets to buy out computer. There's even potential future, computers known as nice and
competitors and to basically exclude them from growing. In the emails words of Facebook, had Mark Zuckerberg, these businesses are Nathan with the network established. The brands are already meaningful. If they grow to a large-scale, they could be very disruptive and then they bought them as a result of the pandemic. We have seen many small businesses close down in America, over a hundred thousand of them in a recent Gallup survey. And at the same time, the tech companies have become even more action. And we know they're not going to
take the scrutiny laying down, you seen it in Australia. You seen how they are acting aggressively in the marketplace imposing. Your will on weaker competition, backing up as much consumer data as a can, including on some of the companies that they bought them. And they are acquiring company, whether it's in Australia, or the reaction, to the lawsuits, in the US, are we know this isn't going to be easy. When did the European Union have certainly made progress on the Privacy side. They enacted that gdpr to address data privacy and I've been working for the last 2 years to implement
it. On the competition side. They've already fine Google three times. And of course most recently the European commission proposed a digital markets Act and the Digital Services act to address a range of issues that I will let my friend talk about that was so what's happening in America? Well, first of all, are there have been proposals for privacy reform? There was a major investigation as, you know, in the House of Representatives, led by my friend, David cicilline, and with proposals coming out of both the house and the Senate, I put forward many bills to address the
Monopoly issue that we have a major bill in the Commerce Committee. Led by Maria Cantwell. On the Privacy side, systems of law, making or different, of course, as our legal tradition. In the US and Europe. But I do expect the both of European and American approaches will reflect our society. Shared values, including respect for individual rights transparency and fundamental fairness. America has a major Monopoly problem right now and it actually extends Beyond Tech, whether it's cat-food, whether it's caskets, whether it is online travel.
If we want to fix our problems with big Tech, we need to fix our competition problems to our Monopoly problem right now. Threatens the strength and dynamism of our economy and our future prosperity. And we know it's playing our Tech area. So, why do we need? Well, first of all, we need areas issue. We need progress with Tack. And I think you've seen that with these two recent lawsuits filed at the end of the Trump Administration, the FTC suing Facebook along with attorney generals throughout Country as well as the Department of
Justice has suing a Google and some attorney general's involved with Dad and I would predict more to come in the future. They bastress structural relief which is significant, but they also need the resources to be able to continue these suits. I actually represented MCI in my other life in the private sector at a time. And they were breaking into the Monopoly Market to take on AT&T and then later the broken up belt companies. And I had a first row seat. I'm to see all of that to see the benefits we saw in America with lower long-distance rates with the
launching of the incredibly successful cellular phone industry. All of that Came Upon because Regulators were willing to act, but when you look at the money, they had back, then in the number of people in the agency back, then these agencies now, now a shadow of the farm. South FTC. Jay and I trapped in. So that's the first thing we need to do is to make sure that we make sure that those agencies are strong. So why is this so important in America? Our whole country was founded on this idea of economic freedom, of religious, freedom, political Freedom. That's why
our founding fathers started our country. That's why people fled to America. And in fact, even when you go back to the Boston, Tea Party that was a rebellion not only about taxation without representation but also about not having to buy their teeth from one Monopoly. Are you go forward? And you see people from both parties of the Sherman Act. That guy was a Republican senator Teddy. Roosevelt was a Republican president. And through the Gilded Age, they were willing to cuz of the outcry of people in our country to take on the big interest whether it was the farmers with their pitchforks in
Iowa or whether it was union workers and the street. To Chicago. And that is our country's Heritage and we literally been stopped in our tracks in part because of conservative court rulings. At one point we were zero and 15 in the US Supreme Court with antitrust cases before that court. So a lot of this has to do with one. As I mentioned about being the support that we give our agencies to putting judges, and people in charge of antitrust that are going to take this seriously. 3 building on what we feel right now in our
country, is a lot of anger over a too-big. That's what a woman. Who is? I met in a diner? Once said to me, things are just too big and I think it's an easier way of putting it, then going into the Arcane details of antitrust law. In fact, I think that we would do well to start calling it competition policy like they do and so many other countries. So in addition to Two beef, Supreme Court being an issue and our courts in general, and the resources of the agency's, and I have a proposal to fix that with Senator Grassley, that's actually bipartisan. We need to look at
changing our laws in America and dad is changing of the burden of proof, who has the burden in the mega mergers, whether it be the government, which is now, or whether it is the emerging party and I think that would make a big difference. If we change that at least with respect to the mega birchers, it would make a big difference. If we change the standard right now, are you have to show that a merger with substantially lessen competition? We could use my proposal and change it to materially lessen competition. We have to do more with exclusion. Eric Honda
start looking back at some of these deals that were made in the last decade or so like Instagram and WhatsApp that ended up when we Actually, look at the evidence to be very problematic. We need to start collecting information on concentration in industries that stopped many decades ago. And we need to bring that back as new chair of the antitrust. Subcommittee of the Senate. I plan to do a lot of this with oversight hearings. And the like, I will say on a positive note to your America Ireland has been nominated by the president
as attorney general. I think that he is someone that understands antitrust someone that will take this on in a big way and he is someone that actually has practice, this kind of Law and has headpieces involving and I think that's going to be very helpful. Last thing I want to say, is just told Adam Smith, The Godfather of the capitalist system audited. He would talk about the invisible hand Entrepreneurship is the key to a strong capitalist economy but he said
only if we have a government that effectively Hanks on and these are his words, the over Army of monopolies in America with our Fierce sense of Independence and Entrepreneurship. We have to remember that even successful companies even popular companies and Innovative companies have to play by the rules and their success didn't give him a free car. The harm competition, we don't have to choose between having the tech companies in competitive market. Those who argue we do 2:10 or false, our current social contract with
big Tech needs to be renegotiated in the US, that means setting new expectations and putting new rules of the road and play on privacy on transparency, on political ad on interoperability and yes on antitrust. That means updating our laws and actually not just talkin about it but doing it we need to put the trust back in our nation's antitrust laws. Thank you. And I look forward to hearing from my friend from Europe as well as any questions that you have thank you. You so much senator for sharing that very
strong and historical to tend to trust in competition law. I like to turn to expected vice president, Mike rate of us are now for some of your thoughts on the same topic because commissioner you've been heavily mall for years and the way that the European Union has started to regulate the space shuttle to there are a significant from the table, not meet the Digital Services act in the digital Market fact. The what is The View on this topic from here? And where did you see the biggest challenges in relationship? But, thank you very much
and the wall, it's it's great to be here, because that's as Tristan said, this is not for declaration seats, for, for taking action. And that is the big encouragement. Because the main challenge here is his speed. It is to to act with this sense of urgency because it's with with, with me right now, know about technology Inc, the coup in attempted Conquest, in the US, the Cambridge analytica scandal at what we know from the social dilemma. This is the wake of cold
with no snooze. There's no way that we can wait not if we want to to to cherries and to make the most of all the good things that comes from technology at. If we want to give everyone access to world-class Health, if we want to have Educational Systems that we really can make the most of every Talent at you if we can make our citizens clean and easy to get from. From HEB if we want to fight climate change, all these amazing opportunities that comes with technology if we went to harvest that it's a matter of urgency to get
in control of the dark side at of Technology. I'm done and we have that we've got the starter that I really appreciate you very kind of into to appreciate this with a privacy. So the sikan citizens as a as a human being with integrity and indignity have digital citizens, right? The right to be forgotten from the ownership of data, the right to choose. We are still in the process of implementing. This is definitely not perfect yet, but we took that really important first
step and and we focused on the Citizens First. Now I know why we have been doing quite a number of antitrust cases. Not one, not two, but three Google cases. We've had one Amazon case right now and then next time it's in case we have vast investigations both into the Google app, ecosystem Facebook. But also a number of complaints are also on on the Apple ecosystem. Of course, goes with our other portfolio of us work. But what I realized that in the last Monday, and with me, of course, many many, many more people is that the antitrust work in itself
will not be sufficiently strong. We need more. And what we need is a regulation to work with competition law enforcement at. We need that in order for it to my Chrissy, to catch up with technology. And I think this is only natural. I think this has been the case with every Industrial Revolution not democracy needed to catch up. It was a question with the first. It took decades before we did it weigh with with child labor before people has access to through the right skills before they had decent working out is before they were in able to organize.
We are in this situation now. Only with much more urgency that democracy must catch up with technology and, and this is the, this is what we're trying to do. We have tables and now, two proposals, that didn't to Services back, and it did until Marcus Act, and the dentist offices that deals with how to deliver services. Like, Or a multi-platform or social media services, and distinguishes between who you are and that landscape on object to Gramps. That is also the case for the Denton markets act because you're more than welcome to be successful in Europe. If customers like your product
you more than welcome to grow. But the thing is not with success with power comes responsibility. And this is what you see in these two. Proposals that platforms will have to provide much more transparency and responsibility to have transparent ways of organizing things. If they find that, something that you said should be taken down that they knew to find that they give you the right to appeal that they give you some of the independent Arbitrage. But also that things that are illegal are swiftly taken down. Because it's
one world, the physical one, the online world. It is one world and we have had discussions over a decade as to what should be submitted, and it cannot be that online. You can find everything that is illegal are offline and and that is the purpose of the dental services act. And it's a fine balance that we have to strike here because I'm the one hand side. We want to make sure that the excitement to terrorists and the excitement to to building bombs old full tide of you. Just taking a while. At the same time, for serving freedom of speech, freedom
of expression, which is score in the US democracy as well. As in the European markets, has docked will focus on how to do your business. To make sure that when you become a gatekeeper, and here, we are literally talking about people who keep the gates. As to whether you can do this to Sonos. That's, we have taken that, they competition cases our experience and unfair trading practices. And for the real giants that has his real Market power to say, there are a number of things that you cannot do. There's a number of things that you would have to do. That
could be that you cannot just take other people's beta. You have to give them they that they tell yourself you cannot and leverage your position in one market in another market and all of that to make sure that we have an EverBank Field that we have competition. So that amazing innovators entrepreneur, businesses can scale up and show the best to potential customers. And you know, all of this, eventually we learned and we took the inspiration from the US because after the second world war, when when the founders were starting to build the European
Union, inspiration from the Sherman Act because they saw was a negative impact of the Monroe. Police of the thirties in Europe, they took that inspiration and made that European. But with the same aim for a free competitive and open market and it is really encouraging. Now to work at the same path. There are differences and I'll let you stationed. There will be differences in legislation ending our approach but I think we can, we can share the same name, but democracy must catch up that democracy. Must make sure that we have is the best of what technology can
bring by harnessing, all the dark side, we are inviting to to create a, a trade and Technology Council. High-level with you as friends in order to Have a place for this kind of discussion so that we can take action and hopefully also mold a global approach because he's our Global businesses and its democracy is I think we have a responsibility to pay the way for a new take on this. So really happy to be here today, really happy with the discussion and I hope that you share my sense of urgency in order to take action. Thank you very much. I love Margaret.
I loved her line me a wake-up call without a snooze button. That was pretty good. Middleboro. Thank you so much. Commissioner of these topics, they Loom large in political circles outside of Washington DC right now, online with us. Can you talk a little bit about how this is affecting Americans ordinary citizens and what you would like to do about that in country? It's affecting Americans in so many ways. It's hard to even the overall Monopoly. Power people basket by the smaller
jurisdictions in our country at hurt people hurt people. When they want to start a small business, there's a lot of Monopoly. Power can be a disincentive for individuals who had a particularly hits minorities and women, and you've seen the number of minorities in America small businesses in certain industries, decrease over the years, until all of this has an effect on people's well-being, the radar in equities, in terms of income and in terms of fairness
in our country, people is this information on. On the internet and I really appreciate it. Margaret going into this because this fact I was just seeing the two sides of this on one side. You've seen I emailed go out early and if he mail plus I'm going out to do. There's a bunch of vaccines available in one place, they weren't available then they put it out on the internet and then people were able to use the fact. I'm so it to me that was just the obvious. There's just information and there's actual information that goes out on the internet. Companies responsible looking at what our policies
are. When it comes to, that is going to be he going forward. The other thing is privacy, is the privacy and yet we still don't have a major federal privacy laws in the US for years. The big tech companies fought against that Privacy Law. And what has happened recently, It's at because I have started doing it on their own lo and behold. Now, the tech companies are saying, hey, maybe we need a national Privacy Law and I would agree. I agree before and we have, in fact introduced one out of the Commerce Committee and the
consumer online privacy Rights Act, which would establish consistory consumers, can access and control. Their personal data is being used, is the mtcn state attorney, general the tools, they need to hold the companies accountable new areas life, right? Privacy Health, privacy. My Fitbit with even more and more technology that are more invasive. When there's not really rules in place and this is something I've personally taken on with the Republican, senator Lisa murkowski of Alaska. And as I said, We have the ideas out there and we seen what has worked and what hasn't worked around the
world. And now it's time to act of the algorithm issue which was raised by, Tristan earlier is why intensive just raises the head of apple and its involving Facebook without mentioning them by name. Why is it that we all have to be picked up when one company to make money has decided what information you're going to see? And what things are going to here? Including disinformation all of that has to go in the trust was when we look at the solution that's what I'm hearing from people love the fact that
they can talk to their Grandma. Now on the in the face when they can't post, that is important. But they also know that would happen if the top of them, is my inside, a gas by the man in the White House at the same time. Actually further, I'll buy information and years of this information. I need the mission has failed to this issue of no democracy catching up to take a logical development in the approaches of technological development. Over the past
three decades have been in remission lessen, the bishop fast and break things Well I mean I can go there but obviously Technologies to call out once but that have more guard rails for privacy at one of the things back to being in a trust and then I'll let her talk to buy out Nathan editors of a search on. Google is when all of that is happening, that makes it really hard for these alternative technology that will have more bells and whistles to protect his fingers, the rise up to the top. And that is a
reason. I don't mean to keep you all in a night's rest but I will, that is one of the reasons why in our country. It's so important to look at that because you're literally watching the ability of the company to come up through the private market and offer more privacy guard rail. Innovation, that we can expect him in a world where democracy has caught off a little bit more with technological development. But I really share in this point here, we we see amazing entrepreneurs, amazing Innovations be made.
And we see then a, a shopping spree from Big Tech and we are now changing out procedures or our interpretation of existing procedures in order to call in mole of those Acquisitions. In order to see if if this is actually enabling competition or it's just well yeah making sure I love that. You have no competition or you don't have yourself, they cost of innovation because you basically have decentralized Innovation to all the smaller businesses and you then just take him
afterwards. And the point here is that we need a lot of innovation. We are to fight climate change. We are to make more inclusive Society. Is there still many things that we should do anything. Can possibly think of today. So obviously we want a a business environment that is that is nurturing Innovation, but would not accept Innovation. That goes in a completely different direction. As I don't think Society has ever done, there's always been a framing by
Society, by democracy to say, well, this is the framework within that frame. Go go, go. But there are limits to everything, so I think we should. We see a system where there's much more room for a smaller Innovative companies to scale up to become a real thing in impulsive. Will also be a bit of use of into a personality so that you can have different Services while anyway, haven't them to work together so that you not cooled off in just one ecosystem because DeSoto Block in effect. Is it one of
the features of of how the market is working right now and end the second? The third thing is that, we will also ask them the companies to be much more aware of of the role that they pay. That is what to do. Some Architects will do to make them aware of what are the obligations? What are the predictions when you are, literally keeping the gates for other companies to be able to do that business. But also to say you have to do a risk assessments, not only have all the wonderful things that can happen when people use your
platforms. But also, what are the risks? And that. Missed that vending found a big mitigated on that, we have an independent audit because what Kristen said in initially, we we have an issue with our democracy. We cannot just leave it to the market to fix this. We also need as democracy is to say, you need to be responsible for the risk that you are posing as to what is actually happening here. Because a, a democracy, has to take place in, in an open public forum where things that I tell you to be
contradicted, can be fact-checked just as well as can be agreed upon. So this idea that we can just have our own data speeds only that the reality that no one allowed to disturb, that is also part of of creating a a real Digital Society that that's can can Harvest an even better. Democracy are from what we're doing right now. And, and in order to do that, we need legislative proposals. And we need proposals that are enforceable because otherwise well, Open state will not work. Thank you for mentioning,
but I had one more thing, that's more you as specific and that is that the right now? We have such concentrated capital in certain areas Valley in New York. So I think one of the things that a new Administration can do is to have more often to bring it back and to try to incubate the development of these new technologies across the country. I wish I think we'll also talk to have this more independent thinking when it comes to developing new technologies and the commissioner said a number of these Technologies are out there right now. But if they all got
bought out, if they all get bought out by this painting companies that want to have Prince, I'm you're just not going to have another kind of innovation. It was only after there was structural reform that we saw all these incredible new things. And we stopped having cell phones that were like this bag and work now, I love to hear both of your thoughts on the transatlantic, cooperation, on this new social contract. What is a lot of legislation now taking place in
both of you? At the, what are the opportunities for working together on global standards? And how do we also get the democracies house side of Europe and United States in North America? I do think we have, you know, a very rare opportunity here that the US and Europe old strong democracy that I think that's the fighting back at as as Amy just you know, made us all see it is an excellent example of this can be threatened can be shaken, but will still be sustained and I think we have a special responsibility to take the torch and
2 to begin a global discussion that made obliges, Amor to take action because the discussion has changed so much over the last 5 7. 7 years when I started it in in this in this job and I was walking up and down the hill. If you was going over to that woman about Google cases, come on. Now, it's a completely different conversation. You know, they are straying into doing a load. The Canadians are doing the Indians are doing. They have too many things. Also works very well with data using
you could you share is at, in order for days to to be useful for, for Innovation, South Koreans that the Japanese, you know, all over the world. There is a debate that weren't there five, seven years ago. And I think there is an opportunity for the US and Europe to take the lead here. Not to say that thinks you'd be coughing. But but to say, well, this debate that we are having now has come to time to take action at in order for things to change. Because I think many people share this sense of urgency
that we cannot wait because markets they are tipping as we as we speak. Net worth. Effects of being increased, as we speak of the benefits of marginal, cost coming down to Sero. They are being realized as we speak and the covid, pandemic has increased, the use of Technology all over this planet. And this is why I really encourage that we that we take this torch and, and go from a, a, a nuanced developed into staying debate that takes place all over the planet, to figure out. How can we take action in order for
citizens to have the best possible use of digital Technologies and not being sort of a basically the products and that creates more wealth for Barry very few people Thank you and the same question to you, Senator? What is the opportunities for that transfer and also realizing that a lot of the large tech companies are based in the United States but also what might be? Some of these challenges are obstacles to a stronger transatlantic cooperation on this. Sure will. I personally, agree with much of what Margaret said, except for one thing, when
she said you were wondering, who is that woman? What is she doing? I, I think that I still get that in the halls of Congress. You know, when you are a disrupter in your taking things on and huge interest, in the case of attack, right now, we have two trillion-dollar companies. Companies that in America are, of course, for good reason, but also, I disliked for reasons. And so, I think what we have to do is not have Hazard a destroy these companies and Destroy. What they've done that. Since its goal of the goal, is to make this work. And as
you so aptly called the topic today, having a new social contract in the US can't do that alone. We are proud of our companies in the people that work for them. We know there's major problems and we can't just say, oh they're in the US, so we're not going to do anything about it. And the best way we do something about it is by getting our own act in order. Which means you have privacy laws and us is information laws. And yes, USA changes try and I trust laws. It is also working with the world. When I was writing my book, I actually looked back and saw way back during Bill Clinton's presidency.
When Janet Reno out of the justice department, announced it for Nation on the international level when it came to antitrust. Well, that was then and it was a good thing to do then and we needed even in a bigger way. Now, we have got the issue of China out there and some of the really bad stuff that's been going on there, including their own antitrust, and competition agency, which now appears to be not for the purpose that we think it should be. And so by only working with our allies and with others, are we going to be able to create the force that
must be reckoned with and create those? International standards. And I agree that the US should be leading and not following working with Europe and other leaders in the area. So I just don't think you can go it alone. I think that actually we are given how powerful these companies are in the halls of Congress. It's going to be really important for the administration to work internationally on this issue as well. And I'm actually I think some real positive here as that Joe Biden is someone who's willing to take on tough things. He cares about working with the rest of the world are the
Secretary of State Tony blinken is I who has a vast knowledge of what's going on in the world and what disinformation campaigns where the fact they've had on so many prices across the world. So I think he will be a good Ally as well. Thank you. I mean where we're getting close to time he right. I want to hear from from both the commission. On the senator, a social contract speaks too much more than just. Our government is also the citizens and the, in the industry that is really the focus multi-stakeholder collaboration around
these issues, are your thoughts on. How do we make this? A true social contract. Weather is fine. I'm citizens from users. When does the Dynamics here? Is that it is really tricky for for each and everyone of us to to do this house house. First, I think a number of the services that they use their kind of addictive. If you, if you were I not setup through Netflix yet, then then go see that the social dilemma. So it's really tricky to dude, oneself. I have this strange habit of reading terms and conditions once in a
while. I think I'm one in a million and I also do my, my cookies settings, so, because I don't much like the look of the tracking of what? I do know that takes a lot of time and you know, the effect of me doing that. Is that right? I forgot what I want wanted to do online. I think it's really important. You know, how democracies we take a responsibility to give people real Choice, real empowerment, that you really know what you're saying, yes to and what you refuse. And, and I I think is social contract is void. If it's become, so complicated that
you have no chance of figuring out what what's, what is my real Choice here. So, I think that we can only talk about to a real social contract. When we have the business is really on board to do things that people can conceive, can engage with feel empowered. And when we ask as legislators and enforcers are making sure that the legislative framework is there and is enforceable because otherwise I think we leave the citizens powerless and really frustrated. And the second thing we will do. Bye bye. Doing this. Is to make sure
There is a, a market that is nurturing services that is built with with privacy as a default with wizard of the consumer interest as the default option. So that we get many more options than the business models, who are based on on the tracking of what you do, not only when you're in the service but also, when you're doing something else, when when the business model is basically treating you as the input for their own production. So I think we have a lot to do before we can serve as pests, we
have a new social contract because of social contract is built and it's in building it up when we can create the trust because what we need is to be able to trust technology, we will still have even more advanced algorithms and we will have Quantum Computing that will be so unbelievably strong and fast that we believe the snow. Things missing today. So so this is the time to make sure that we get the features, right. That's that the Democratic framework is strong enough for us to create trust in technology to be able to, to make the most of it. And this is
the process that we were in. So we're in and I think the early days of building a social contract where each and every citizens feel empowered and and that they are in charge of their data and what they want to do with them and that is core. Thank your commission and senators from your side intensive, engaging citizens. And also the industries that were speaking about into this. Empowerment is key here as a commissioner explained. And in the US, we must start a major, major social movement. Now,
I think it's there, but so much of it gets complicated when you've got two different parties said of going in there on foreigners and making different cases. And I think this crosses party lines. And let's start looking at a small businesses are very much hurt when you have eight ways that are literally controlling access to services on to decide who gets at the top of a search engine, which algorithms affect how well your business as they have to get aboard. Even big companies know exactly what I'm talking about and I can't tell you how many big companies have
been in to see me in the last year, to about concerns, about how they've been hurt by the big players in that are controlling the gateways to Marketplace, some of these companies never want to come out and publicly say it. Then you think they're going to get screwed if that's not a side of a monopoly, I don't want it is, but making a business case for entrepreneurship is going to be really important to bring on a republican support as well for these changes second privacy, which is always been key to the really the American way of life and making the cases for what can be done
with this data, the Commissioners pointed out showing that you're going to be getting used, here you are literally a tool for making profits. For people that has a way of convincing people that this isn't fair, and that means monetizing the data. If they are going to, if you are going to consent and I think it should be a lot harder to consent to give your dad, and then you should get paid for that, and that could be a way of creating some incentives for making change. And I don't think we're going to go back to the days. When a presidential candidate has happened during the Gilded Age
and into the progressive ear in the US. We had campaign songs about antitrust. They did or it was one of the major things that would talk about at state fairs across the country. Teddy Roosevelt was once literally a shot and he was saved by a pain that he had in his pocket and I'm very sick. And I trust speech, but he went on to give the speech anyway. I think all of that happened back then, because the people got so angry and they were the ones who pushed the leaders. So that both parties were literally competing with each other on what more they could do
when it came to a major social issue of their time. We're starting to see that you saw it with net neutrality, when the fcc's website broke down after a John Oliver piece. You seen it with various candidates being willing to talk about it now, but we need to Focus on what we can get. And what are the things that bothered me about the Donald Trump of your? I appreciate it. All the lawsuits that were bought at the end. It's so much of this was made in terms of Vendetta against Donald Trump's enemies and coaching it that way. Instead of this is a
major Society problem for all of us, no matter what political party that you are in, all you got to look at what happened. On January 6th. All you got to see is people standing in line for vaccines that aren't even going to be there because of disinformation are people afraid to get vaccines because of disinformation. We've got the evidence and now we have to move forward as a country and I am, I'm going to be making that case day after day, and my new position and will give me the opportunity to lead on this and to join a Margaret and others in making this fight like we've never done before.
And she said, we can put on the snooze button, this is the time in move. Thank you. Can you tell my Senators? Tristan to help us include today's conversation. Let me turn to you. It's 2021 and the years ahead, bring with them, significant changes that will spend a mentally altered the business models of Silicon Valley, the impact Society, what kind of future do you envision for? Well, there's been so many great comments that they've been shared here and I just don't agree with just how urgent this problem is, you know what,
conserve a cigar had shared about? We need stronger. Digital democracy is right now. It feels like we have one model or if you almost like a year to take a brain implant and put it in a person and they become a cyborg, take a society or democracy. Can you put social media brain implant in that Society right now? It cause the kind of national psychosis where everyone speaks in different voices, these different realities and is confused against itself. And I think what we need is a model for a cyborg democracy, that is stronger. That's the ideal here. We don't just have, you
know, I will have a monopoly on how many brain implants you can put in there. Do you want to build a healthier brain implant that makes us stronger? They can't actually succeed. So I just really appreciate that. The notion that we need, a different social contract, we need to break up the concentrated power so that there are different brain implants. Brain implant since I broke the Mach receives that make us stronger. I looking at 3 at the history of environmental regulation, it was proven, what it would it take to take lead chemical out of our society, either the scientist in 1980
to prove that lead dropped the IQ points of children by 4 points and they've been played out against future wage earning potential of children. Now I'm bringing this up because if you think about IQ not as intelligence, but as a problem solving capacity and if the threshold for taking lead out of our society, was it dropped an individual kids like you by 4 Points. Imagine what social media does to our societal IQ are democratic IQ our ability to solve problems in a Senator Klobuchar said, when you consider this geopolitically against China right now you put that brain implant
in a democracy and it actually devolve riq down to 0 because if you can't agree on something whether its climate change or covid or vaccinations you can't get anything done. So what I'm excited about this is what it looks like going to 2021. As we all know many of the recommendations have been made here and think about what it means to become a stronger digital democracy, where that model out complete, the China model and his other comments have been shared that this keeps up with the cock rate of change because right now, the clock rate of democracy is slower than the clock rate of all the
new technologies in the increasing fragmentation of platform, since things like twitch, Discord, Rumble and so, we need a kind of common framework because he's increasing other platforms. Come along. We have to make sure that they have better standards and practices in a day, actually, put users best interest at heart. So, I just appreciate all the comments have been made here and hope if this continues to accelerate the conversation to reform. Thank you so much stress and 4 ending. I was on a positive note of what to tell democracy can look like. I may just be more than just as soon
are real. And if y'all come up when you pull a person this place thank you very much to send her an Executive Vice President at this day or for today's exciting conversation and for sharing your thoughts and what a new social contract might look like. And also thank you for your leadership and commitment to make him. Listen to Larimore inclusive trustworthy, and fair, a very warm. Thank you to all of you who joined in the session from your homes, around the world, in South by Southwest. Thank you.
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