About the talk
We represent foreign investors obtain the visas they need to develop and grow their businesses in the U.S. We also assist U.S. companies in obtaining the visas they need to retain and keep the foreign born talent they need.View the profile
So I've invited some friends of mine up here who are all a bunch of lawyers to talk about some practical profitable business cases for entities that are not going to evolve digital art, right? So, come on up. And as you come up, just introduce yourself. We need some extra bag. Phones, please. I'm Jay, just introduce yourself in that chair. I miss it over here. Does microphones not on? Turn the microphone on. Microphone 3/4 mile on. Hi everyone. My name is MJ granados and I am so
sorry. I'm Jake and I was with the way I'm a business and real estate. Transaction of attorney here in Miami, Florida. And I own a boutique law, firm in and m.j. What kind of deals? Do you do you? You put, you put big business deals together doing business deals in the millions. Tens of millions. What's the biggest deal that you've? Put together for clients in February. We close and 80 million-dollar transaction. And next. May will be closing and 862 million-dollar transaction. So this is a person who doesn't fuck around with
bullshit, right? That's the main takeaway for you to get right? All right. Why don't you both take the opportunity to cure? My friends are on. Mine is? Thank you. I am Indy previtera. I do divorce law all things for smart people and protecting their smart assets and I love empowering people for their divorce and separation. A custom microphone. Can you guys get the microphone straight. Now please, right now? My name is Patricia. Castillo Flanagan. I'm an immigration
attorney. And my passion is to help us employers. Obtain the talent, they need to bring tonight Estates. And also for investors to be able to expand their business into talents in United States. And Patricia is going to be doing a presentation either later today or tomorrow. I do. Remember the schedule tomorrow. Entitled entitle. How I didn't realize sign is crucial for human rights. How how and why blockchain technology is really important for human rights? Oh, she she's represented people who had to come to this country because
they were escaping some really bad stuff. And she seen firsthand what happens when fiat currency is used as a tool of Oppression against people and so she should be giving a talk about that. I'm Jay, by the way later today or tomorrow. Today at 3. Don't be late. She's going to be giving a talk entitled. When what's it going to look like? What's it going to look like when a doubt rise to buy commercial real estate property in downtown? Miami look like the first time of Dow price to buy a commercial property
in downtown. Miami spoiler alert is going to be a shitshow. What is going to happen and so we should start anticipating it, right? All right, Tom. My name's Tom Flanagan. I'm also a lawyer shocker. My firm helps people get their life back on track after they've had an accident. And I'm also an entrepreneur practice. Probably several different types of areas of law throughout my career. Suing insurance companies representing Banks did a little bit of work with the state attorney's
office back in school. I intern there. So my talk tomorrow after Patricia's is going to be going after the rug pools in the scammers. And I know if you guys were here earlier, but I'm giving a shout-out to the CEO of Rug Doctor. She was giving her speech and I thought they're going to be a really good tool that I'm going to talk about later. So so one of Tom's Areas of expertise, I guess you would call it because once he get the Judgment against the bad actor, it's not like the bad actor, just was, okay. You got me.
Here's the money right? He he has to, then go and find the money and investigate and track it down. So he has a lot of experience in that and he's going to be doing the talk tomorrow about how he's going to go after money. When the first rug, pull, case comes to his firm. So you can just start thinking about that and his presentation and the rug pull presenters earlier today are like perfect book at right. They're going to help you avoid getting screwed and he's going to show you what to expect if you do get screwed. All
right, and last but not least. I'm Tom Petrelli, we take clients from chaos to Clarity and we specialize in high, net worth assets cases for technology companies in Philadelphia and surrounding area, biotech companies, and pharmaceutical companies. And so just to translate that into plain English for you guys to understand why he's up here. What makes is relevant for you. What Tom specializes in doing is basically taking companies apart. Piece-by-piece. So you'll get someone who comes to his firm. The owner of a very successful business at
tech company. For example, hint hint. Right. And Tom essentially takes your life apart and takes your business apart on behalf of your spouse who you are, divorcing. So he's going to show you later today or tomorrow. I'm at the hospital more time tomorrow, maybe. And the topic is. I don't know what the topic is going to be around. How if your if you are the owner of a tech company, raise your hand. If you're the owner of a tech company or plan to be the owner of a successful tech company. A prenup. Time to
be talking about how a divorce lawyer or really, it could be a bankruptcy lawyer or any kind of investigator for that matter is going to take you would go about taking your business apart. And this is really important because it's a lot of people acting like the metaverse is someplace to hide out in from the real world. And, you know, spoiler alert. The sheriff who comes to seize your assets doesn't care about the metaverse. They're just going to come and seize your assets, right? All
right, so have a seat and yeah, I understand you guys sit. Oh, we really don't have enough seats. Yeah, but that is out of room for any of us are too. So. I said all day. Yeah, but then it looks weird. All right. You guys take a chair? And my hope is that this is an interactive conversation. Right? So we're we talking about some some real-world business youth cases for entities that don't involve digital are some of them are going to be things that we are aware of that. We've seen some of them are going to be things
that we have just studied and thought about. And some of them are just going to be Imagination. And what I would really love to see if we can get going. Is if you all have some ideas for a business, use cases for nfts. Preferably that don't involve digital art and we can, you know, you got one, two, three, four, five, plus me, six lawyers. We all own multimillion-dollar businesses of Our Own. Let us help you think this stuff through, by the way, we're not getting legal advice. When I giving
tax advice all the disclaimers here, right? You know, that had to come. All right. So who wants to kick us off with a cool business? Use case, that doesn't involve. Digital art. I'll take a crack at it. I he's going to hold it closer. All right. So I do a lot with real estate transactions and I am really interested on how and if these are going to change the world and one of the most interesting topics is how. And if these are, will be used, or could be used to purchase real estate between a lot of people. So there is a case. If used
in the UK in 2019. It hasn't it's not being done right now, in Florida, but hopefully you would some changes and legislature and once it catches up with something that could be done by 10 ft is in real estate. Could really open up to a lot of people owning property and investing in property. Not only in owning it but also in the debt on property, so, that is extremely interesting. You could basically open up, you can unlock Equity without borrowing or moving. You have a house, you need some extra cash. You could
basically, with nft, get some cash to do a project or do what you need. So, and if these would be backing, it would be backed up by the ownership on the property. So that is an extremely interesting use of how you could apply this, in, in the real world. If you own a property with a bunch of other people through, nft, you could also rent it and the rental income would be divided between all of them. So would the property management calls and whatnot and with NFC. So you're basically avoiding you getting rid of that middleman and you're able to do
everything through the community and the people that own the nfc's with you on that property. So it's fascinating to me. This is going to change the way that real estate works. I real estate is a very solid investment that has been around forever and now it could be available to ever One that don't you don't need to have $100,000 or millions of dollars to invest in real estate. Now you could be doing it through the vehicle of entities. Real estate is really the original non-fungible. Property in the world.
Aren't the next. So, I'm very interested in disrupting the legal environment people. Our clients don't like paying hourly fees and feelings and I can have a value and I'm looking at different ways to create more value for the clients. So, one of these, I've kind of tossed around in my head, was having nfts that have specific amounts with it. So, if you think your divorce is going to be a fifty, fifty thousand dollars, creating a token, that's $50,000 that you can use and apply, and if your, if your divorce only cost, $20,000, you can then go and
resell that token to another client or potential client have have it have a market that maybe not just for my Law Firm before other law firms that are interested in this and possibly, Make some of that money back. So if you spend $20,000 for $50,000 or $50,000 for a token, you spent $20,000 or $30,000 left. You can resell that token for maybe the same value that's left on or more and keep reselling that token down the line and creating value so that you get some of that money back and of course of your smart contract. At maybe, maybe as an attorney with the law firm, we get
out of 10% off the top of the salad or something like that. If you do ideas and I've had it, I've had to try to disrupt the marketing. Can I change the way that the lawyers interact with clients to create more value for the client? The same thing could be done by accounting firms. The same thing could be done by architectural firms. In the same thing could be done by really any professional service provider, rather than a building you by the hour. They could sell you a token, wish you could buy. And then, you know, it's almost like a like a like a Store gift card if you will.
Which can then be transferred for the unused portion of it that would really change the way that I would really change the way, people interact with professional service providers and would really change the economics of Professional Service. Businesses are doing good. And one of the benefits I think is all the lawyers up here is a lot of times we try to show our clients, the value were providing them and sometimes clients want to rush through a case because they're worried about the legal fees. They want to rush through a case or they'll say, I'll take a
settlement even though I shouldn't because I just can't continue to afford paying these legal fees, will having an entity, or a token that can retain value is a way to really keep the legal field. Ethical and also provide clients the value where they don't feel so rushed or so pinched for the dollar, they can maintain their value and also even spell the token later on. So it's really a great way to picture the future of Legal Services. If you had to hire a lawyer and accountants and architect attack
strategist, anything like that. And All things being equal to two different people. You could choose to hire. One said, look, it's going to be $50,000. 4 in in ft. And whatever you don't use, you can resell and the other one says it's going to be $500 an hour and the fees probably going to be somewhere between you know, 40 to $75,000. Which would you rather do? Who would rather by the end of T? Raise your hand? Who would rather just pay by the hour as you go? Okay. It's about an even split. That's really interesting. okay,
I'm not trying to convince you one way or the other, I just Then you by the end of tick bite. That that's a really interesting idea. Why we hadn't considered. This is the whole point of this panel. Yeah, maybe a little Tokyo is transferable between firms. Not just between clients. All right. All right. A r l e s in the yellow over here. That's, that's a possibility. And it is, sometimes, it's not in the past, I would agree with you, but I talked with clients all the time. And sometimes they questioned the value
and I'm always serving my clients to find out. How can we provide more value? And I think if we could be, I think it would make legal fees and everything more transparent. And I just said, not just for a lawyer for any business because you're providing something where people can transfer it, and it's almost like, you're buying a credit. And to me, I think that would be a more efficient way for the business, to do business because you have your, your stream of money or not. You don't have any of the store after we haven't sent her over Bill people, but that's what clients think sometimes
right in. This would take that inefficiency out of the equation. You repeat your question back so that everyone can hear it. And we also have it for the recording. So yeah, so what's your idea? It's a good idea, but there would have to be that up work at because I have the consumer. I'm sitting here going. All right, I'm over paying you $30,000. A dollar cost averaging that overtime. Okay, so you're keeping my extra interest and get on paying an extra 10% So I would have to get something on that other side as Anacapa. So let me
flip this around. What if you went to a and I'm not going to keep saying lawyer cuz everyone thinks I'll never need a water. Right? What if you go to an accountant, right? What did you go to an architect? What if you go to any professional service provider, or maybe it's a lawyer. Yeah, please thank you. And what if that person says to you that I'm going to charge you, I'm making this up, $500 an hour and you say to them, tell you what, instead of charging me, $500 an hour. Why don't you sell me an nft? Why don't you sell me a token
and I'll give you $40,000. I'll put it into this this token and you credit me at the rate of 450 an hour. So you save 10% but whatever. I don't use. I want to have the right to sell that token to someone else to recoup, whatever, whatever I didn't use and they'll still get it for the same for 50 an hour. That could save you money on your professional service fees and it could allow you to recoup your unspent, your unspent fee. You recognize what I'm describing here. Right? I'm not asking if this is, like, I'm not trying to convince anyone of
anything. I'm trying to. But we're trying to do, is, we're trying to expand everyone's thinking and realizing holy crap. This concept of an nft can be applied in ways that most people aren't even thinking or talking about and it will truly change the me to changes the whole dynamic of power in every relationship. Make a photo there. So a few questions who owns the token and is it a stablecoin? So are you basically buying is there anyway? Your clients can make money? Otherwise, I would either pain and Fiat or I can just pay in crypto
and maybe you would accept something. Maybe you accept a crypto. That's not a dollar yet or maybe just ease or Bitcoin. I'm just saying like, what would be the benefit for for a client to have to go through the work of buying your token and then especially your divorce alert, especially during divorce. I don't have to deal with reselling an nft. You know in that case would help you save your 15% off the fee. What if it's an f and is in, is the extra work I have to do.
He is $500 an hour, right? And you say I will pre-pay. It's like a retainer fee. Is a retainer fee that you can transfer the unused portion to someone else and it can be bundled with other services to you getting a discount on the fee because you're buying it as a token. Okay, I mean, I fully understand the concept. I just think, like the application of it would be more interesting if it was something that required. I could just change the sound. So try to make sure
before we can do some of this is actually beneficial for the client, cuz the whole idea is I'm trying to take some of the risk of the client. Okay. And share it, right. So like personal injury, but contingency fee, kind of thing. If you're trying to take the rest like you don't have to pay ahead or you have to be Your? You're putting together currency and nft and and and they're not and I'm trying to I keep trying to separate them so you can see the nft utility. I'm trying to see the utility in this. Number one, you save money. So
instead of paying it, you saved my sample was what it was 20,000, but it didn't end up being that in the whole point of it is $1,000 coin. How much? And they say, five hundred bucks an hour? No, I understand. I'm interning as well, but I don't practice and then to the first. So, the first, so the first H 500 s h, 530 hour. 555555, you get $20,000 into the case and the case has now been resolved. And you spent $20,000 at $500 an hour. You got nothing to show for it except the services in the results scenario to
you say. You know what? I'll pay. I'll pay you $40,000 at the math, easy will call $400 an hour. and now, instead of consuming $20,000 in fees, maybe. Because it's only $400 an hour. You only get $15,000 in fees and you've got 15 from. For me, is 30 is 35. $25,000. You got $25,000 worth, or credit left over. You got a $25,000 store credit left over and yes, you now have to sell that nft to someone else, but the benefit is, you can recoup your $25,000 and you got to consume the services at $400 an hour instead of
$500 an hour. Now, some people will say, you know, what? The juice isn't worth the squeeze. Saving $100 an hour isn't worth the trouble of having to sell the entity on the back end. But some people might say, well that is worth it. And this could be applied in all different kinds of business relationships. Not just lawyers or accountants in blockchain. And I was saying, you know, what would be with who I want to hire? Is? Someone who can do solidity, or you can actually program a smart contract.
I mean, that's kind of what I'm kind of getting too. It's like everyone wants have a coin but actually being able to go, we like going to lawyers when we're buying a house or something, cuz you're the Arbiter, you know, you could sit there and make it fair, instead of, you know, we can go to the expert. And get that smart contract done and get that in a few programmed, whatever it is, and I was just wondering if you guys are like interested in, in that we are on how. And if these can be used in business, with
people. This panel that is ideas. Do we have for you guys to develop businesses? That could be in a few base options that I see journey. And I see a lot of problems in many areas and I'm hoping you guys can sell some of them. For example. Every time I'm going to file a case on behalf of a client, I have to show who the person is. I have two children, medical records to prove my records and the location for the angels in obtaining. Those documents can be burdensome can take years and some people sometimes cannot even get them. For example, clients on times. Can you get a birth
certificate? There are over ten million people in the world that don't have a passport to have a birth certificate at Fallas. It will be great. If one of you could come up with an idea of getting a system where you can actually check their background of a person to have that person identified and go all over the world me and be able to say I'm Patricia Castillo plan. Again, we are having to show a pass for having to show a birth certificate. He also will be great. If you do go help some of my clients weather for their shells. Unfortunately, I know that's the name. Any of many of us. Don't
really believe that by choice. If we are necessarily need it to be two sets of prints, a boyfriend immigration system for half a day, because that I filed every day, I better have a bachelor's degree from my client. My client has to be able to show me the transcripts and any plumbers that will be great. If one of you could create a system where the credentials of their professional and location of connection to a person could be verified and that person who carried it everywhere and show this is where I went to school is that my transcripts to start my grade and they don't have to call
their schools at my Nexus anymore. That might, they might have burned down 20 years ago, and you can actually provide up for some proof that the person I shoot that also employment records. Immigration laws for employment. Records of my clients are is all the time. But that means I still have anybody from The Old Company to go and ask for a letter of recommendation. Because guess what? That closed a while ago. So, why are you Google Assistant to verify their employment history? That will be great. I also think that and if you could be used to verify medical records, do you know
how the College of Massage Therapy? Send records to my office? They sell faxes, and your records. When I sent a request to a doctor, to send me your medical records for me to send to immigration. They send me the send me a fax, it will be so great. If one of you could come up with an idea, walk around your medical records. Yeah, but his dental records and medical records while we're talking about is. All we're trying to do here is expand. Everyone's thinking of the
microphone over here. Expandable was thinking so imagine a child is born to look. I'll give you a real use case. I have a file that my staff keeps for me and it's like, basically the arjon file. And so every time I have to apply for life insurance, every time I have to apply for line of credit. Every time I buy something, buy a boat by a car sign, a lease, by every time I do things, the lenders, the underwriters. They all need my whole life story. Right? And so, I'm constantly having to send them my tax returns. My credit rating,
my personal financial statement, my business financial statement. My driver's license. I'm in all of my life has to keep being sent and you know where I keep it in a Dropbox. That's right. Keep it right? Like it's stupid. Write imagine a world where a child is born and a child is given a birth certificate and that in the end. The child has also given their own nft. Write their own non-fungible token for that child and everything. That happened in that child's life. The child's medical records.
The child's school records when a child get their driver's license with a child get their first bank account, imagine everything in that child's life becomes part of this nft that lives permanently on the blockchain. And wherever that child goes, that child has access to their whole life in one place securely mean. You do raise your hand if you're from a third world country. Okay, you guys understand what I'm talking about? Raise your hand if you're not from a third world country. We
don't really understand what I'm talking about. Right? Because people who there's, there's large parts of this world where you don't get to just like, Call the hospital or call the county, right? You don't have access to your records. Imagine how great it will be when it when a when a person relocates from one part of the world to another part of the world that they could take their whole life with them in a non-fungible token. That would be. Great for
Humanity. no, wouldn't Why wouldn't it give her the microphone? Address to privacy issues. Then you'll be here privacy because you have the same key that you're going to use to protect your your your your cryptocurrency would have the access. How about when you go and apply for a car loan for example, so they will have access to it. Correct. The portions of it that you want to give them access to through a smart contract, whatever you want to talk about. A person
just was born. Right? And let's say, is a person, has some medical condition and it's all recorded. And right now we have laws that will protect the rate of insurance. So when he will apply for health insurance or life insurance, I have lost that will protect the raid, but maybe in the future, Laurel change will have new government and everything will change. So it will it will be on the Block changed my life insurance right now. So you have privacy, how secure would it be?
Who will have access to it? And now how? Yeah, basically. How do you protect it? So there are many, many issues that needs to be addressed specifically from a legal standpoint and from a policy as well. Isn't it fucking great that we're having this conversation? Cuz guess what's going to be happening in the future? People are to be trying to do this, right? And I think it's a great thing and I think that we can use Smart contracts to protect the privacy and to make everyone's life easier and you're concerned about the problems with it. And You know, look around
there's 5,000 people at this conference, right? It's only five thousand of us. The vast majority of people in this country have not a clue. What any of this stuff is. We are all of us. Look around. Look at each other. We are the thought leaders. We are the people. You you, you you, you are the people who will be having influence on how this stuff gets used in the future. And what does panelist forced to get us thinking and talking about it. So I'm not going to debate you. I'm not going to argue with
you. I have no need to be, right. I don't care what you think, or what, I think what I care about what we care about is that we are talking about this stuff and we're thinking about this stuff, right guy in the yellow shirt has a So I like your example of just how mentioning unused gift card cuz that's kind of what it sounded. Like. I didn't really see a difference between blockchain technology and the gift card from what you guys were talking about. So when I was hearing, what you guys were saying, it sounds like a kind of beating around tokenization of people
tokenizing yourself, someone during our lawyers looking at. How can I lost my old coins and then people can buy those coins and maybe just for a few coins you can get some consultation time. And for another set of points. You can have a meet and greet with some of your resources or the people, you know. In for other planes, you can go into a full lawsuit or divorce or whatever. That's a great idea. Are you guys aware of of the talk? That would be gone around the world where cities will stop charging taxes and start
going with a SAS model. Anyone heard of this? Okay. Where is a service? Sorry. We're increasingly entering a world where? People are you don't have to own real estate to preserve your assets because we have cryptocurrency, which is in many cases, a better preservation of assets than real estate. Is certainly a better preservation of assets than fiat currency and Bitcoin will soon become a better preservation of assets than gold, in the middle of next year.
When some mathematical formula that I can explain happens. So, people are going to increasingly, not be buying and owning real estate. Right? We, we, we don't have to own cars, almost anywhere to get around between Uber and Zipcar and all that kind of stuff. We don't need to be tied, two bank accounts with cryptocurrency. We don't have to be tied to regular mail. Right? I mean, does anyone get your bills on paper anymore is All Digital now, right? And people are becoming
more and more and more mobile perlier Tom and mindee gave it talk about. What happens when people start getting getting married on the blockchain. We are progressing towards a world. I think where people are increasingly going to be living their lives in the metaverse, it on the blockchain, which means You know, where have digital mouth Nomads going from place to place. Miami is like in a little bit of a feud right now. Case. You didn't know it with San Francisco and they are San Francisco.
Call the mayor of Miami jokingly, not like a jerk, but basically stop stealing my people cuz we keep taking people from all the major cities to bring them to Miami, right? Well, how's Miami going to fund itself when it's got a whole bunch of people living here. For now, right? We're not paying property taxes. So what's begun, what people are beginning to talk about is where you essentially pay a monthly fee to the city that you live in in order to have
access to city and county and Municipal Services while you're living there. So you don't have to say you like it and I can tell from the expressions of some of your faces and some of you were like repelled by this idea. But the fact that matters this is what people are talking about. And you know, if people start talking about this, eventually these are these are the kind of things are going to start to happen. So we can either stick or head this and pretend like, it's not going to happen or we can say, wow, how can we profit by thinking this
way? And that's what I feel like this panel is turning a little bit into a debate with the audience. Cuz we got a bunch of fucking lawyers on the panel. And apparently we got some lawyers in the audience and they want to like, have a debate, and there's no winning and there's no losing. All we're doing is talking. All right, so I'm an escrow company seems like something you could replace with a smart contract. Have you guys seen any of that or how does that operate? If you've seen it, I forget what they're called to have a specific name that right. Now. Are they operate
with smart contract and they deposit your coins? That you're you're crypto, an eighth and the terms are decided scarily, not by a lawyer, not know a lawyer involved. And then the smart contract will they will execute the microphone right there? All right, I'll repeat it. Absolutely. So if you look at the way someone contracts are drafted, it's an if this then that. So it's an easy application to make a set of my contract or a lot of different divorce in and family law. Contracts work, that way, child support can work that way
with child support enforcement. Instead of having the court staff has to draftees court order saying where, you know, something for the letters, automatically trigger, and go out based upon An Occurrence, which will beat non-payment for you Court paper, Sumi bring me back into poor cuz I know you don't have the money to Black that hundred-thousand-dollar marital settlement. You owe me. And I want to make you pay. So a smart contract and get around this by making it.
Execute $100,000 is due, its execute. It's in your bank account and it cuts out all this bullshit that people have to go through with the court system. To get execution on these marital settlement Agreements are contracts. Yes, it actually application. Is there anyone else back there or Tim? You want to just speak up a little I'll repeat you. What if someone doesn't have 100,000 in their bank account? When it's executed, what is someone doesn't have 100,000 if this happens, then that
happens if this happens in that house, so let's start off with the question of forget about nfts. Forget about cryptocurrency. Forget about the blockchain, forget about smart, forget about all that stuff. Let's just say that you do 20 years ago before any of this technology, existed, a judge orders, a spouse, an ex-spouse, to pay an amount in alimony, or child support the judge, write it on a piece of paper. Stamps it. Issues. E word. The spouse is ordered to pay, they pay, they pay, they pay. And then one day they don't pay. They don't pay because they don't want to. They don't pay cuz I
don't think they should wear a because they don't have the money to pay. You got me. You got me. All right, the way that used to work the way it currently Works Mindy. Tell us how that works. Absent smart contracts. So there's a few different things. Normally, you file for contempt, meaning you breached an order and you go back in from the judge. And the judge says, the person who supposed to receive the money doesn't receive the money a day goes by, two days goes by a week, goes by, they didn't pay the rent. They didn't pay
their private school tuition for the kids, right? They call their lawyer. Hi, I didn't get my money. I say, okay. Let me call their lawyer. Bring bring my lawyer. He's not here right now. He'll call you back in a few days later. They finally connect. We connect to your phone while you're not paying your rent. You're not buying groceries and you're sweating your ass off. Cuz you got, you know, private school tuition coming up and me while this whole thing is creaking along, like, molasses and winter. So play it out, but go step-by-step
and help her. Understand how everyone? Understand how this actually works today. Hello? Other lawyer. Hello, your client has my money and you know, this because we spent $100,000 to get to this agreement. I don't debate that supposed to pay your client. What are you saying? Are you saying? My client didn't pay? I'm saying your client didn't pay. Well, that's terrible. He should have paid. I know, I agree. Let me look into that and get back to you. Okay. So now, I
spend a week tracking down my client, listening to his bullshit. And he says, he paid. And I called her back and I say, ring ring. Hello. Listen, I spoke to my guy and my guy said he paid well, your guy's a liar. Well, look who's to say because he says that your clients, a liar. And so, nothing personal. We're friends back from law school. Nothing. They're not adversarial between us, but my guy tells me one version and your client is telling you a different version. So look, I guess the
only way we can resolve this is we're going to have to have a hearing in front of the judge. Would you like to drop the order or should I would you like to drop the motion or should I drop the motion? Okay. Thanks. I owe you next time. I'll drop them off too. So so you drop the motion. So now it's another week goes by. She finally drops the motion cuz she's busy. She got stuff going on and then she files the motion and then the judge sets the motion for hearing. It's now been like 5 months since you didn't get paid for your hearing date. You get is 6 months away from when you
filed for the motion while you're still not getting paid. And you hope the judge doesn't reschedule. Well, things happen, right? I mean, covid code. It happened. The course for kids free is today in reality. And so what we're excited about is imagine what would happen if you could just use a Smart contract, so I'm going to give it to Tom and mindee, take it away and talk about what all that, same scenario plays itself out when you're using a smart contract and the whole time you're listening to this everyone. I want you to not be thinking about a
divorce. I want you to not be thinking about child custody or anything like that. I want you to use your brilliant creative imaginations, and I know you all have or you wouldn't be here and think about I could apply this in some other way in my own business or my own life. I could see how this could be used in a different context, you'll do that. Alright, so here's the scary part. So in a smart contract in that situation if you didn't have $100,000, and you were supposed to pay whatever it is that smart contract with look to see if
the money's there, probably come back, give you a warning just issued automatically then give you another warning. This is how I'm going to majan. So we go give me maybe a third warning at that time. There's no judge smart contract should just say, okay. I'm going to try to pull that money out of your account. However, much I can get and they can't get it. Then some issue a warrant for your arrest to the Sheriff's Office and the sheriff's. Are we going to rescue? It would be way more efficient way quicker, and I think it would probably Well, not in 3 days, but I think there is, however, it's
scheduled to say. I don't know, it's be something reasonable like every 3 months or I don't know. Stress enough for anybody on this panel, how molasses low the court system works. And this is where people lose faith. In the people lose faith, in the justice system, and his lawyers, who truly care about our clients. We want use this wonderful technology. We want to use the future to help our clients solve these problems. The earlier I said, you know, to be smart contracts. Carry a lot of the times, they're not written with lawyers and it's not that we prefer our own
contract. Although I think my contracts are pretty great Value Center not self-executing. So, I, we see a world where smart Edwards developers and attorneys work hand-in-hand to put together these agreements so that it can beat Properly written as to what the parties intend, and then the developer will coated properly, so that you minimize the risk of hacking and making sure that this actually works the way that it's supposed to. And I think the hardest part will be having the centralized government aspect of the court system, kind of releasing some of their
control over this. So that the smart contracts can work properly. No, not all smart contracts can be smart. And I have issues with the real estate world because the real estate world, are these going to be dependent with smart contracts upon a third person or third-party intervening to say? Yes, this did happen or this was completed before that smart contract. Goes and I think that becomes not a smart contract at that point, cuz you have three parties involved in cell centralized and to talk about what you're saying. Yes,
these companies success that hold escrow not a real estate, but, but they do exist. And it's not, there's no interpretation by a lawyer. And what not. But the things what you're saying, it's it really is an escrow agent needs to be there because there's some things that you can't code there specific instances that you cannot foresee. So it might look it might be written black and white but there's the great areas and there needs to be an escrow agent. So yeah, I absolutely agree with that. There's more concerts are great for something to be trapped at. So smart contracts, I think are the
future for a lot of this. It's a question of, how do we trapped in a way so that there aren't mistakes or we don't need? Third-party intermediary is to To execute and make us more contract work. So, you asked if a mediator was rest of that. Well, right? So you're saying what happens if we need a mediator? If the people don't agree on the transaction. And that's, that's, that's where I have a hard time trying to see the application, some smart contracts, to the legal world, where we have contracts, where we have certain requirements,
for a contract to be met like mutuality, right? So do we actually have an agreement do these? People actually know it isn't its conference with the right. If it is, it's more for like, when there's a performance requirements and it has to be and then, and then you're supposed to do this. But who's measuring, whether you did it or not? Is it an action like payments? Yes, that can be a smart contract, like you can see it came out of my wallet. Yes, it's been paid. So that could have been smart contract could apply there. But if it is, did they let the tenant leave the space? They're
releasing in room clean. Wish it so who is going to determine whether it's broom, clean, conditioner? It's not, it's very discretionary and when they're, when it's written like that, then it's where you would need an interpreter if the parties disagree and an escrow situation. So someone's holding money, then that would be an escrow agent. But if it's between, for example, in a divorce, then it would someone else would be the person that that would determine whether that action was performing or not. Really an idea. I thought about in the past was like why
someone hitting combing all the decisions for something like family law. Save for a specific area for the past fifty years as president. And coming up with some type of algorithm, to dispute resolutions on the block. That's not going to be some sort of code, where this is a yellow code. This is discretionary, this could trigger a mediator and then there's, there's no discretionary in this part. This is an This must happen than this executes to Tom's point that this is got to be somewhere out there that we can figure out. Right, but what smart contracts are rigid, right? So
they're meant to be rigid and would have quotas law. So it's supposed to be, if this happens, this must happen and that then you're versatile. That's comes into a gray. Arrow has a problem for lawyers. This is on the real estate front. So currently there are companies that are tokenizing pieces of real estate. And those are security tokens. Righty or c1402 I believe is the token. Is it possible? This might be better question for the Dow conversation. But if if a dowel purchases of real
estate building, can they then just make the tokens of that the normal erc20, because if they can just value it as, you know, directly comparable to the value of the real estate asset. Well right now none of that is happening in Florida, for example, so could it be possible? Yeah, probably. Maybe maybe we'll see but it's really interesting how even just getting it out to actually purchase real estate could could be complicated. So stay tuned for that talk cuz it's super interesting. I
want to watch something. He's he's working here because I don't know if you know, but all these high rises in Miami, where build with tv5money. What is the money actually? People who buy their green card? So I can best. See half a million dollars, going to be holding and there were two ways. You could invest the $400,000. You can either give the floor. $500. I said that you may get back in 78 years or years. I always tell my clients. Well, you know, I can't really advise insecurities. You have to decide yet to decide what kind of plans you want to go. But
remember, you're getting from percent of a building where you going to sell that too. But I guess now we know fun to go talkin to, like, it makes it real that you could actually sell you one percent of the hotels with somebody. And I think it's at Is it very different ballgame? Fractional ownership. Okay. I know that on the NFD, there is some type of privacy because I heard about this project. But also I cannot give them if I want to bring the clothes and I cannot give her the money because it needs to be owned by that person generated by that
person. If it's an NST, that will solve the issue in a okaces when it comes to investment in United States by the government curse, is that the money is legal that he came for a little Source, swear by all means. If you have $500 that you earn, if you can give $400,000 to your coughing and it doesn't, you don't have to go to the nft route. Gifts are allowed Lottery prizes anything that you can track to a legal source of letters all the time. A girl had a heads up. We got 10 minutes to try to get the same slightly back on track
with schedules. Just for the heads up. And what comes next is what's coming next? What happens when a device a commercial real estate property in downtown? Miami is going to happen the first time a dog tries to buy a piece of commercial real estate in downtown. Miami. That's what we're to do next. After we do a break but 10 minutes more then we got to do that. Hey, so I'm just curious. What is the current landscape of the tooling that you use on an everyday basis that has equipto or a blockchain Capone into it? And
you know, what is the current barrier to adoption for a law? Firms and a cryptobase tools? Yeah, so the question is, how many tools do y'all use on an everyday basis. Law firms? That have a concealed component to it. And you know, what is a parrot's with option? So I can speak. I mean, our Law Firm. It's limited in that we accept cryptocurrency. That is the basic thing for what are Law Firm can do. And you know, how many people we've had so far? All right, it's big number. You ready?
I'm looking to adopt as much blockchain technology into what we're doing as possible. And that's something I've been working on. So I'm open to anybody who has any suggestions. Have you heard of the pitch where somebody built a low code? No code tool for lawyers to create their own smart contracts. I've been playing with one of those. Yeah, Loco do code. Microphone. So when your guys's experience with understanding that kind of deep philosophical, roots, of the modern legal framework, do you believe that there is just going to be
or currently exists? A fundamental contradiction between the aspects of crypto bring to ownership and the method by which the state you do an axle off. So, for example, one one example would be, do you think the state will ever accept that they would not ever be able to like Rivers property rights at this point, you know, most property somebody owns or most ass at the somebody owned can be reversed that ownership can be reversed by the state and of course, fundamentally a blockchain may not allow
that to happen. Another good example, would be privacy crip down. It's right around the corner, and this is definitely going to enable people to. Have ownership transfer ownership being full and not pseudonymous like the current protocols. It says yes. So my main question is is in your long experience of understanding the philosophy of law. Do you believe that there's a fundamentally a conflict here? Can this be overcome or is this on a collision course in the long run? It'll be the last question, cuz then we got to go to break. So
this is my opinion. I think the way the law works is fundamentally flawed. I think that the bar associations are runt like, you know, what are the mafia? And they are so slow to adopt to one of our John's points. Like in 2001. He had people coming to him saying, hey, do you think email is a good idea if we use emails at safe? When that's all freaking backward. Lawyers are so So I think you're going to have to parallel worlds operating for a long time, like side-by-side. And that's my issue with smart contracts. Like we can design is Mace Mark Hunter as we want, but
I think we're still going to have these their parties involved. We can record marriage certificates on the blockchain but we're still going to have to record them somewhere else. If the recorders office, we can record deeds in the blockchain, but still think it's some in some jurisdictions, in some States, Army backward, and we're still have to go to the recorders office. So you're always going to have that that dichotomy, not always, but for the near future. I wanted to say that, yes, we went to law school in there, but the real
world is very different for many years and Unfortunately, they lost and the government's don't move up spaces technology, a job to advocate for changes and to help him help the government, understand where the changes in the law need to be make Made, for example, that will tell me my client needs a current passport, but my client because they're so that's when I see technology. Like another form of identification will be user for my client. And at that point, I have to obligate. I gave the lawyer said. You cannot ask for my client because my client has no legal World way to get
it. So yeah, that the theories were free for some time, but we have to change a signal and we are The part where we had the power to do so, but, you know, all of us have the power to do to do. So, between here and learning from each other. All right. So we're going to break. We come back from break and Jay is going to talk about what it's going to look like what she thinks. It might look like the first time. I doubt, I'll try to buy piece of commercial real estate in downtown, Miami, which, of course, you could translate that to the first time.
I doubt try to buy a commercial realtor piece of real estate anywhere in the country, right? And then you can obviously go from a commercial real estate to the first time of Doubt tries to buy a hospital. The first time, I doubt rise to buy any kind of a business that is rooted in the real world and have to be managed. What's a kind of look like, right? She's and talk about real estate, but you are all very smart. People will be able to make those connections. So we'll take a quick break and come back for that before we go to break your phone.
Your phone's out, take your phone out. You don't have a phone, OK, and point the camera at the Q R code. Went to Kmart the Q R code. and when you point a camera at the Q R code, you will see a page it will pop up and On that page at the top of it is a button that says ask our John now. So the idea here is, you can post questions and I'll be getting them on my email and later today. We'll have a session where I'll just go through all the questions that come in throughout the day and I'll just start hitting and
answering questions. I'm already getting questions about I need a local. I need a hedge fund lawyer to help me. Stay compliant and navigate SEC regulations. Another person is helping our helping helping to move our company 10x to the next level. Another one is I have a 10ft collaborative project with 20 artists launching February, 2022 and currently raising $125,000. We've already raised $50,000. I need the money to prepay artists and build a marketing team. Blah blah blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah,
blah, blah, blah. And I guess they want to know how to avoid. Going to jail when the SEC bodyslams them, if they fuck that up. But they don't actually read pull somebody. Yeah, they should all drugs. Buddy. Hey way, so I'm getting a bunch of questions like that. And post your question. Someone posted some questions about I can talk about taxes. I can talk about sec. I can talk about tax strategy. I can talk about the difference between tax compliance and tax strategy.
I'm doing a session John later today or tomorrow on tax tax issues regarding regarding and obtains. I think I might be tomorrow. So just whatever you got, either me or one of us. Can probably give you a helpful answer so posted during the break and we'll see you back in 10 minutes. All right.
Buy this talk
Buy this video
Our other topics
With ConferenceCast.tv, you get access to our library of the world's best conference talks.