Events Add an event Speakers Talks Collections
 
MCON
September 15, 2021, Denver, CO, USA
MCON
Request Q&A
MCON
From the conference
MCON
Request Q&A
Video
Learnings from investing as a DAO
Available
In cart
Free
Free
Free
Free
Free
Free
Free
Free
Free
Free
Free
Free
Add to favorites
679
I like 0
I dislike 0
Available
In cart
Free
Free
Free
Free
Free
Free
Free
Free
Free
Free
Free
Free
  • Description
  • Transcript
  • Discussion

About the talk

See Eun and Rolf, both OGs of MetaCartel and contributing DAO members of MetaCartel Ventures aka. Venture DAO - the first ever investment DAO created on Ethereum. They go into what they learnt, their experiences and their stories.

About speakers

Rolf Hoefer
Venture DAO
See Eun Marc
Partner at ALPHA273

I build companies and help entrepreneurs use tokens to unlock hidden value. Tokens are digital ways to represent something of value on shared platforms like blockchains. Tokens are the killer app of blockchains. INSEAD PhD in Entrepreneurship/Organizational Theory, founder, multilingual.

View the profile
Share

Hi, I'm a blood Mage had metal cartel Ventures, and I also happen to run a hacker Village in Korea with like, 150 people living together. Who's all doing crypto, a bunch of houses. Super cool. He's like the central node in Korea. If you want to know about crypto has been around for a long time and 14, ran the first YouTube channel about crypto. Then people came around him. When I go what the what the hell is tripped up and then they try to find out. So it's already cold working together. Then

it's already cold living together. Then this bad boy, got a bunch of houses in a big fucking building in the middle of Soul, which is not that cheap, and that became knots, right? So super cool, super bigoted, coordination trying also Kearney kind of figure out how to take this real life. Community of living people into sort of like a dollar structure. Hit Em Up. Yeah, but let's talk about MCV. So what's what's on TV in a nutshell for you? So MCB stands for medical tell Venture doll. It was the first investment

that I know of but I think it's probably in general have to be championed by member inside and then they go through a vetting process and the way it works is you contribute and you get some M C B shares in return. The amount of either you can keep you determine. The number of tokens are getting returned and that matters because the 70 members vote on chain for every investment that we make with the tokens that we received. Right? So people contributed more than kind of a bigger bigger and do what you last have a little bit less Jose. That's the court of MTV today.

We are a group of 70 members that I extremely diverse mostly Builders mostly. Founders. There's some investors also has some product peoples and marketing people. She'll know what else? I will. Bunch of people. Yeah, so let's talk a little bit about like there's a weird balance between like 1:00 is like permission versus permission membership. Write a doll has and then there's the other aspect of like, yeah. Like, how do you how do you cure 82? Like maximize for as its investment? Obviously, how do you calculate membership in order to maximize the

purpose of the Dow, right, especially because we like 70 people. They're pretty involved in general in crypto. Everyone is super B, pretty busy. Right? So coordination is like a real big question, not just from the perspective that we are endowed with a almost nobody's fault. I'm right. Which like compounds kind of problems. So, You no permission written permission, has access to kind of the Dow. I mean, you should talk a little bit about nuns and Dax style. But I mean within them, save yourself. The way that we look at new members is, how does someone add a set

of resources that is somewhat unique compared to the existing resources, we have inside the. So one of the things that we pride ourselves on at MCV, which is investment dial. Perhaps, the first ventured out is also what we called it. Unlike most species that fund a product that sells a product to solve the problem for people somewhere else. We fund products that solve problems, we have is like a VC funding, its own problems. Because we have 70 people that are pretty involved in the ecosystem. We think we have basic knowledge of vanish, right? And so, we're

trying to fund the problems that we experienced in which we actually trying out the very tools, some of, which refund or that we want to fund. Do you want to go in that direction or? Yeah, it sounds like before we head up, head over to the community, like Towing. Dalton Lane Direction. Let's talk about, it's honestly like, you never been in an investment. It sounds really good from the outside. Right? Cuz you get access to Superior deal flow. I mean, if it's founders of the first to know about the Overflow, from other Founders, there's all that stuff, but there is

like, deathly on a site. That's not really mention like a blood and sweat Blood, Sweat, and Tears apart. So I don't know where you want to start with this. But I think the first one ride which I alluded to earlier is everyone's pretty busy building their own stuff. So the question is Reedy, who gets to work done? Like who does the work, right? And it's easy to say. Well, you know, we leave it up to the community, but sometimes everyone's busy, it's just a way of life, not getting. So this is fine balance between people

taking ownership of certain initiatives and driving them forward versus kind of giving up ownership in letting other people run with it. I think we have to give an example. I think what what what's happened over time, within the within the Dow is that, we've had certain groups that start at yourself organized and kind of take on certain roles. What does that mean? We have a whole bunch of everything. Cool lessons in the Discord when we Someone at the screen, these deals right there with us to any deals. Some of the people who end up screaming while taking the first call

with a specific deal, will typically be the same type of people with some something between 5 and 10. People I tend to do primarily that right. Once that first call is taken one or more of these people who are on the call, will go back to the Dow end in a Discord Channel. Created specifically for the deal with basically say what they find out, right? And what they think and then is a whole discussion process that starts the process. But it's like the five stages right? From like a thing, New Deal to like examination scrutiny and we have a soft bowl and then we have to

finalize voting on Chene. And then the Voting. Is is a moloch structures. That's like seven days before he concludes, and then after the vote passes, it's either. Yes or no vote. We are there interests that we don't invest and so are these different Pages. We have 250 different groups that have emerged in a way that kind of stuff, organizing to address, whatever. Whatever needs are in that stage. But sometimes there's no one in that group is not a very well. If you don't have full-time people, it's not that easy to run it down. Yeah, so that's that's like the end. We had this conversation

with in the school, right? Like the balance, the difference between like MCV and the loud noise? Like The Thirst, the operational part definitely needs to be managed with end up like drop that you'll process. Right? And so you can have some of those someone who's kind of does like back off to this see operational stuff and I don't actually ask expedite the process then the the GPS I guess, whatever you want to call it. They make the investment decisions, but the kind of go back to another like a pinpoint that I felt a lot is actually it comes to pooling resources

and this is about like when we have guests we have like 70 members in the Dow, but how can we get a Do it enough. This goes back to like needs an acid thing. Like how how can we get like a presentation of the assets that they can offer, right? The big thing might be like. Purple hair company says, hey you want to go to the Twitter push, right? If I'm Avicii, it's pretty easy to get everybody coordinated to do that. But your ass like, all right, who has these media resources? Like what kind of meat of resources? Do we have in? Will people won't people do it

while we do it or not? Or even like the same thing with a deal? Like I brought, you know, if I bring in like a 10ft games, you like who actually has the chops to be able to look at NFC game deals. If I don't even have that knowledge that start with, I mean, is it is very easy to be like, oh ji ho has the chops easy, but there are some other people who might not, you know, might be investing who actually has a specific specific interest in a few games and how, how can I know about that beforehand? So I can go ahead and kept them on the shoulder and then coordinate, everything to try to set up

a call and all that. So on and so forth. When was The Great point? I actually would talk about it, and But look at it in two ways. If I think one of the strengths of MCD is that almost all the members that come have every you need resources, which is one thing that makes it so powerful that we can look at almost any deal and we can we can kind of source expertise within our towel or with an R Group to evaluate that. Do you not a practical problem is is getting that person with the expertise to actually look at the deal, right? So who is that person me? Some people will do more than

others and then actually getting that person to do the work was a great example. So I think that's that's what is one aspect between. We have a bunch of resources. We have a bunch of needs and the problem is for us, not so much having the resources but doing the matching. Yeah, this is so hard. Let's talk about. I know this, I'm going to open up a can of worms, but let's talk about taxes. There's no way we can talk about taxes. So age of pain in the ass, I think for everybody that we started out as we just had to Delaware company.

I want the same rights as no GPS. L p e l e a v person in the Dow is the same. So there's there's nobody that we all just members of the problem is it's a new identity and our newest members and us members. And there's a bunch of issues of how taxes flow through to certain on us members if you have a new identity, right, so that's that no one wants to figure that out. Right? Because that's not fun. So it looks like it's more fun. I think that's why I think another one is the we probably

Realistic, so we all about like coordination and like trying out new stuff. But doing like the dirty ground work of figuring out like the legal entity setup that can handle support. Our operations is difficult. I know you should still probably opolis year. Yeah, cuz there are purple. Company cell aspect where if your worker that's working at several different dolls. You could just get them to process everything and then according to like from the government's perspective. It'll be like taxes are paid. Your insurance is are covered and all that. But yeah, it's great. Limitation is young again

only in the US and there are so many of us choir work. Like just our work life is ridiculous and glue. Just you know, why? Everybody is very, very ambitious. So working like many, many different that Monument working out of many, many different dolls. Like how do you hard to figure out how to match all of those? All those things and get them, get that stuff to line up a bank account? Boxing pool money and then decide how to spend that. And I think that has come up in different forms, but practically speaking, there's a whole bunch

of issues with that, but one is which legal entity and who is inside. As you asked, what kind of taxes if you get kind of an airdrop. Like, how do you account for these kind of things, right? If you do Shield farming, you know, certain members wouldn't get tax in their own jurisdictions. What other members will get tax in the 10 section. How do you set that up? Right? Cuz they don't want to pay taxes because of the legal entity of MTV. When in fact, they wouldn't personally do to this day. He was so much they can eat and every other token.

imperfect information flows, so I think Yeah, these bees out rulings right for helping basically take the house into the real world. That's like a real opportunity space and if I'm taking on my like if you see how we're going to find out today. So if anyone has in fact, they're a bunch of service dolls that have popped up. Right. So they literally help other dowse figure it out. One of the big thing that's super interesting or I think that's emerging right now is, how do owls interact with other dogs?

Right? So, how do I get a token from $1 into another doll? And how do we get to exchange that? Don't got to figure it out, but that's like a gangbuster. I like I can almost out personally invest right now. If any was kind of figure that out of tackle, these kind of issues and it's $1 and I think very soon we're going to move away from figuring out. How do I join one. How do how do we make? That was kind of work together? I mean, even if we have like a lawyer here, with a law firm was like, okay. I'm going to figure out other detail. Nitty-gritty stuff about Dallas

about like, which jurisdictions are friendly to lunch Dallas and what kind of stuff you could do. And they're like, they were open to servicing all Dallas like a lot of money. I definitely thought of something that would probably invested. Yeah, and that's like a plastic thing. That's like crossed out, right? It's going to be with an investment. It's needed within a few hours. It's going to be with any dolls at, that's what I'm in. Dividual projects are starting a lot right now. Yeah, yeah, so that that I think that covers like the non sorry, the non-technical Delta building

stuff. Let's talk about the technical deltawing stuff. I mean when we refused several tools, but let's talk about coordinate just for a little bit. Cuz I know we've we've mentioned that before and we're actually very heavily used it with that are Dell, right? So, I don't know if you guys know, basic website, you go on, you log in with your man, a mask, and then will you interacted with in the last 2 weeks, right? And if they interact with five people, she in being one person and then for other people, then I

have 100, fictional tokens called gift open to the given to me and I can distribute these hundred tokens to each of the five people I interacted with before. No, based on what criteria to a distributor who gave me more value and you have a way of having members of a community. Measure Who deliver value to whom, which is really, really cool because we're moving away from an Instagram world of like, who do I know about why you're following was like, what the fuck is that? What you mean to

like, who actually did something from your value? And I'm going to allocate a certain tokens to that person. And if I talk to buy a few, when I give it to five people here and then I see and talk to you, like, to talk to me also, but the doctor for other people, you start having a network of value flows, that is measured on a consistent basis. And obviously, that will eventually emerge into some kind of identity solution. Okay, how famous is this person number of, in terms of number of Twitter followers, but you want to know how valuable is that person? Right? And because we have, these

communities are the super distributed. There's no, like, one person who sees what everybody dies, and then kind of rates, like, how valuable this thing is. If something right? Is everyone rating each other and in some kind of reputation system, to make sure that you address them, like, issues with that, but I think I should be super excited to using coordinate. That's the dream. Write in practice their problems. Okay? Yeah. So if you are using these tools, there is a couple problems that popped up one is

There's a lot, a lot of problems. The biggest biggest thing technically was so important that you would be like, you know, what did you do for this Epoch in the park might be two weeks and it so everybody writes up this the kind of stuff. They did that David problem is that this is non-standard idea, right? So everybody's writing up stuff. I mean if my right up to diligence, I might write up DD somebody doing Castle might do in a lowercase letters whatever and then were trying to buy you. What each of us contributed within the past 2 weeks, klusterfuk

klusterfuk. It's helpful with in the doubt. But the real value of Dallas again, just goes back to life, dial to dial interactions. The real value of it seems like is We are trying to make what's valuable is not just identification of Friend or Foe, right away. Everything in Dallas right now is you're either in the doubt or you're not we're not trying to do that. We're trying to see what kind of value can we list from this doll that will also enter Opry with with this guy in this other. When are we going to match those up? But the thing is corn, a bright and Justin the data standardization

or Collection part. Nothing is standard. There's no real way for us to do this. So then even when we link up all the social crafts, it's helpful with in the towel and itself, right? Like I think we are kind of mentioning that like, what is a Jehovah said that you're like your keys has like 15 different community may archetypes and then he's trying to see like everything is a guess but I think like whole whole thing behind like crap though was that you could take like pick one right? As you can do like macroeconomics snapshots of things. Was like why can't we do

macroeconomic? Not economically like value, snapshot of what's going on across all dolls. And for that to happen, if coordinates of social graph, we need we definitely need something like data collection or standardization. Something really small. That can be composed of one can plug into all these doubts feelings as it exists today. So it's not as they don't, I think it will become standardized but it's not today. So it's a problem. But I think these are problems that can be solved, right? I think even on top of the, having a Locum where value is exchanged, right? Actually, being

exchanged based on past actions. I think he's a purely web three native ways, right? And to me, it's also a way of actually managing Community is that I'm just taking care of certain workstreams, right? I tend to think of using a self organizing groups. So what doesn't work and what's non skateable, and I've seen is across several dhows and communities. Party to is initially. You have one person that catalyzes a small group 5 to 10 people back in the days in the accident Courtright. That's this is how he kind of got into

axies. I think you have Matthew, who trying to catalyze 42 people and when I was talking to me was like, dude, I'm being burnt out a way to make that happen. Is you to let people break away into small groups that have a small workstream 30 to find scope of work and then they just evaluate themselves based on that. I can evaluate how much about 5 people give to me. But if I do and how much 500 people give to me, I'm going to stop using that tool. This is my phone right now. I can't even remember. I don't want to fill it

in and it is stupid. Right? And so I think the dials is evolving to with some set of self-organizing groups that are part of a bigger structure, has a number of interesting implications for example, yesterday. I was talking to but it was his idea, You say there's a 2080 relationship, 20% of the work. You do you like 80% of your outfit? And we were saying like, it's more like 55, like 5% of the work that you do eels, 95% of the outcome. So, why does that? And I think it's because the 5% of we do is so much more specific. It's just a

small workstream in a very small group that we can have a very large impact on the, like, big a community organization as a whole. And this is why I also becomes another application of that is if I know, I might actually end up doing that for like $23. And if someone asked me like Rolf, what are you doing? I'm like mine this cuz I got to Woodside Eagles, head above specialized, right? So I think the fining people buy a membership to an organization is not as exciting as defining a person by where they lie in the value graph. Where have I delivered value before and

where do I want to deliver value in the future? And I think it's going to be a new way for people answer the question. What do you do? It's much as I feel anymore. Yeah. Something I want to bring to the table with that is. I actually think we were thinking of dolls as In some ways like the ultimate form of organism that's going to continue to evolve, right? But if we think about it more, like natural like nature, like you'll have small cells or groups of cells. That will also have its own

individual Evolution. I feel like, I don't know if my half a year experience that TV or at night now it's like close to your now, but we've been so focused so much on like the greater picture of like, how often do people are going to coordinate at exactly the same time, right? Like that. Much like it. You got it, like Sharde, Sharde that. So, what kind of sharting, that's the right word. What kind of Divisions must we have within? Everything's a flat organization divisions. Can we have within the Dow so that each of these divisions also catalyzes?

Has has has like catalyzing effects, so that it makes the whole pie or the whole organism even stronger. That I'm really excited about a bunch of the stuff. I would like Network Theory. And so there's some really interesting Insight 73. There was a guy called his visitation in Boston, asking a bunch of people looking for a job. From whom do you get a job in the street 2000? People people, you know, really, really well. And people you don't know very well as like strong ties

like your friends and your family versus, right? So what are you going to drop from in the intuitive? Answer would be all the people that I know really? Well cuz they going to give me a lot of information they like, but what he found was that it was the people that that you knew very well. It was people, you didn't know very well. That's how you find the most dropped and he was like, why is that And then you realize that the people that, you know, really? Well, they all know each other. So the diversity of information is really, really low. There's two people that you don't know very

well. They know a lot of different people are different companies allowed. Why is that? Cuz when you draw this out in, like a social graph and you will one node, the people, you know, very, very well, all know, each other all connected, but the people, you don't know very well, they like connected to other social groups that they know very well, what you actually want and is going back to. Your question is when you figure out how to structure a community in a network theoretical sense. If you want to have some strong ties, you one of a small group of an MCPE that you're part

off. And like you solve it again works for you, but you also want to be weakly connected to other groups, right? And there are literally tens of thousands of papers on the strength of weak ties, which would have caught. So, there's an optimal number of proportion of weed. Is the problem that you have right here in the conference, right? Do you meet everyone? The details want to know, is do you like or crew at the same time? You want to connect two different groups so that you can get information, that's how does popping up in crypto, which is like ever-changing

and very fast and very efficient way. So does a mandible Network telegram? Was like, every time you wake up and instead, you have this like off to my structured on the individual level, but you can think of that you could think of that connected to like 2/3 of a doubt, very strong, lots of communication, but eventually they'll think the same shit right about the weekly to others one way of managing dolls. Will require a tool that doesn't just measure of value flows, right? But who's connected to whom and sort of what's the

frequency of interaction? How long have they known each other and how close? And again, there are tens of thousands of of network science paper that latest out and that show that has many benefits to having weak ties. Right? So you don't just want to have strong ties. Want to have, we have something between, we need that shift it. Again that I think that you're pointing to is right now. We're trying to figure out like dolls but those Holdings is pointing us to the the question behind like metal dolls. All of us are learning

lessons with the north house, but this is not being shared across all dolls for other dolls to take in adopt. And I don't know how we're going to get this together. Maybe some I don't know if I don't have a metal exist, but maybe you should not not not just like uber house type of thing. But I really like, we need to get together and start sharing lessons across and Beast lessons are not just about what kind of new features, will be added on to moloch moloch D3. Sure that's a technical solution. But there are so many there, so many aspects. Like, like you said, like, what is an efficient

way to each group stage, maybe less than 10 people? And like, maybe I like 30 to 50 and maybe like, 50 200 hundred and above. What is the what are some of the best practices that I can use? If I'm a particular type of towel? Because a dolly, this in the future that face exact same problems that I didn't know, right? Those aren't being shared in. And also with that. I'm just thinking that maybe some of these tooling, we should Outsource them over to radio. I'm down, right? Yeah, I think we should do the lies. All the dolls with in the middle Kartel ecosystem and Ian a little bit

better and I'm increasing instances of these interactions and actually interactions not not to sleep with Like Cocaine Flow or like actual like we just don't have time or this is not our specialty. So we want to Outsource this over to you. You can solve the problem, come back and then maybe let that also increases week. Tyra. It's like we try to take a meeting at a party that working but also like there's a very specific purpose of why we're doing this. I think you're right. I think like a couple comments about that. First of all anyone who will transfer learning from

Dows 22 others. That person will not only become famous but will get paid a shit ton of money into something that we need today just across the house. Right? And really is as much as like you just go interview people in dollars and you're like, what did you learn? Like go interview mad go interview, like some people seem to be going with a bunch of people write super needed today. While I was listening, but it's super needed today. Dana Point was about like, all sourcing. Outsourcing like so for us to if we have an idea about a tool, we should definitely handle all three guilds

for them to try something out, then get back with us. Like another thing that we needed is like not a board of. Yeah, it's almost like asking people in Dows. What do you wish you had my class customer Discovery in Matthew. Just had like a website and every role is just like what people actually just want to solve their problems today. We should do that. Alright, let's see what we get done. I don't know. That's it. I mean networks, right, MTV bunch of different people with strong ties, connected weekly. It was in the Dow perfect transparent data. We

can take advantage of that stuff. We're not yet, but we will have citizenship. Go to go, chili.

Cackle comments for the website

Buy this talk

Access to the talk “Learnings from investing as a DAO”
Available
In cart
Free
Free
Free
Free
Free
Free
Free
Free
Free
Free
Free
Free

Full access

Get access to all videos “MCON”
Available
In cart
Free
Free
Free
Free
Free
Free
Free
Free
Free
Free
Free
Free
Ticket

Interested in topic “Cryptocurrency”?

You might be interested in videos from this event

September 15 - 17, 2021
Denver, CO
16
60.74 K
dao , governance, investing, nft, token

Similar talks

James Young
Co-Founder at Abridged
Available
In cart
Free
Free
Free
Free
Free
Free
Free
Free
Free
Free
Free
Free
Available
In cart
Free
Free
Free
Free
Free
Free
Free
Free
Free
Free
Free
Free
Jeffrey Zirlin
Co-Founder & Growth at Sky Mavis
+ 1 speaker
Available
In cart
Free
Free
Free
Free
Free
Free
Free
Free
Free
Free
Free
Free
Available
In cart
Free
Free
Free
Free
Free
Free
Free
Free
Free
Free
Free
Free
Drew Harding
Co-Founder at MetaFactory
+ 1 speaker
Chase Chapman
Co-founder at Decentology
+ 1 speaker
Available
In cart
Free
Free
Free
Free
Free
Free
Free
Free
Free
Free
Free
Free
Available
In cart
Free
Free
Free
Free
Free
Free
Free
Free
Free
Free
Free
Free

Buy this video

Video
Access to the talk “Learnings from investing as a DAO”
Available
In cart
Free
Free
Free
Free
Free
Free
Free
Free
Free
Free
Free
Free

Conference Cast

With ConferenceCast.tv, you get access to our library of the world's best conference talks.

Conference Cast
944 conferences
37487 speakers
14316 hours of content
Rolf Hoefer
See Eun Marc