About the talk
Griff Green of CommonStack and Giveth along with John Paller, one of the co-founders of EthDenver and Opolis talk about mission critical infrastructure.
As an employment & talent acquisition industry leader & entrepreneur, I've been in the employment/talent acquisition/HR Tech space for over 15 years. To me, there isn't anything more commercially important to people than the jobs we take or the people we hire. I am obsessed with bringing this systemic change to the employment industry. Self-determined, portable, and borderless work alongside frictionless connection to opportunity. We are #buidling Opolis to create this new system for democratizing employment. John was awarded “Forty under 40” in 2014 by the Denver Business Journal, which recognizes up-and-coming leaders who are shaping the future of the business community.View the profile
I'm a digital currency "expert", evangelist and public speaker, holding a masters degree on the topic. I am well connected and well liked in the Ethereum ecosystem. I founded Giveth to build software to support decentralized communities growth and development especially centered around non-profit causes. I founded the Commons Stack to take Giveth to the next level, creating micro-economies to support the voluntary funding of public goods.View the profile
So we're talking critical infrastructure for Dow's. We are so I think one of the most critical infrastructure for Dallas is actually an in-person meeting space and Nobody Does it Better Than You man. Do you want to talk about like Denver and how it brings supported Oz? Sure. So give a little bit background. I don't think I've actually ever told this story like in like the metal world. So if you don't know, Denver back in early 2017, the third largest aetherium meet up in the country and it went from like Lily. Nobody. We had like 10 people in a dive
shity bar and like It went from that to like, 400 people with a waitlist just to get into a meet-up. They were like, Holy shit, like this actually might be something to this and there was a lot of like moonboy like somos, Ico stuff going on, but there was a lot of really interesting smart people that it just felt like the the meet-up was insufficient to is too much back. Slaps and beer and pizza and not enough like actual like unpacking of ideas and creating a space for creativity. So,
I got with the organizers of the Meetup and I I said, look, we should do a hackathon in their leg. Yeah, we already did that once in like 20 people showed up. I was like no no no, no. No. I'm talking about like let's take advantage of Colorado, social political Vibe, and bring the world to kind of build this new future. And they're like, you know, who's going to come? I'm like, I don't know. Like a lot of people will probably come. So we were hoping to get 401 people mostly because we wanted to be teeth Waterloo who had 400 at least that was the number. They said we're like we were,
so we ended up with 1500 so The first year I think was like 36 countries. And then this year, we had 104 countries represented by 31,000 people online. So this next year we're expecting 5000 Plus in person here in Denver, plus probably another 50,000 online, so it's turned into Something quite remarkable. Actually, we've even that the state government involves. We got the governor's office. We've got the Wyoming governor's office. We've got all sorts of people that want to be cool kids at
the school. So, but the best part about it, we call it a big tent in a blank canvas. So, if you, if you've been to eat Denver, you know, we don't charge is free to come will pay for your food. We give away something like 50 to $75,000 and travel scholarships. We try to remove every economic barrier that you can think of. We rent out a whole hospital and just give away room. So people can come and all of that. Just to give people a direct line to their own creativity of expression so that they can actually put it out there. So, 2019, excuse me, 2020.
We actually called the year of the Dow, a December. And I don't know if anybody else is chalks 2020 up to like Mulligan cuz it was like it kind of didn't exist. I just like did some stuff in my basement for like 8 months at Lake Lily, built a co-working space in my basement cuz like we didn't have anywhere else to go. And so now, I think 2021 is actually the year of the doubt. I think this is really the Advent still like, I mean, I remembered talking to me in about, hey, come and present moloch at in 2020. Like, let's actually make this the year that we built it to act
like a boat on. All the projects that came out of the event. So, I mean, I remember that in 2019. I mean, actually brought up the idea of Molech and most of the people that created were, at least that you were turning me on East number. This is critical infrastructure for Dallas, is like to have people actually meet in person and I will always think of Dallas is purely online and you know, you never have to talk to each other but that's so and so impersonal
and not real and Dolls need to be more of a family. They need to have this like Community Vibe and it's hard to have a community online and eat Denver and events. Like this really allow become a selling point for people to meet and I feel like that needs to be taken advantage of as much as possible for quality in person connection as well. Totally agree with you. And if, if this is like, one of your first events in the aetherium ecosystem in, and there's a lot of faces that I know, from
like many, many, many events, but like, come to these things, that means there is no better way to organically connect with your Vibe, with your tribe and your community. Then to be at these events if there's nothing more Organics in this sort of thing. So like you can't get the same feeling and Discord. Sorry, but you just, you can and just the amount of like, rapid-fire interactions that you can get here. If you're actually intentional about it, like not just sitting on the picnic tables with your face,
buried in your laptop, you know, doing code like actually connecting with people. Unpacking ideas. There's no more valuable service area in the space, and he's kind of Yeah, I think in general we really underestimate the requirements of around culture within Dallas and the tooling that can create culture and positive cultures like positive some games with in relationships 11 credit, another piece of critical infrastructure that we're trying to push out is this idea of conflict resolution and having the ability to actually resolve conflicts within your community is amazing,
Nobel prize-winning Economist. Her name is Elinor Ostrom who she won a Nobel Prize for basically just proving the tragedy of the commons and she's great, eight principles. And there's lots of lots of documentation on them. But seriously, like, I just want everybody in and out to read these eight sentences, you know, and it's super simple. So look it up. But one of them is a conflict resolution in any, I'm sure you've seen it in Dallas where like small little conflicts will just kind of slowly grow and be underdressed and then they fast. And then, eventually it goes straight to ostracism
one person just has to leave the community because they never resolve these small conflicts, that slowly added up. So there's this group called gravity that's coming in. Commons is actually focused on bringing out of the public good within the space so that we can train people to be good at resolving conflicts. It's it's called gravity because I N N, we have this graviton training worried to train people to be like a force of nature within their Community to bring people together. So that training actually starts on the 20 20th ish of September. I'm sorry. I don't know the actual
date, but you can check out the tea, Twitter and if you know anybody who would really be interested in being a force of nature in their community community and just be there to, you know, address small thinks and out. Someone's getting someone else's name wrong, you know, it doesn't have to be like, a major conflict all the time, but having people who, Responsibility. It is within the Dow to be like, looking out for, like, awkwardness within relationships is critical infrastructure. Yeah, I've seen half-a-dozen different approaches to
conflict resolution. So I think the jury's out on exactly what's going to stick. But, yeah, I think sustainability is really the key question, right? So, how do you create sustainability of values inside of the organization, like a dollar or digital Community? It's not that easy cuz you don't have a hierarchical top-down structure. You don't have some sort of centralized or at least you shouldn't, you know, that have some sort of centralized dictates about, I mean, obviously, you can have a constitution or some sort of Manifesto. Those are all fine. Mission Vision Values,
work for a company that say one thing and do something else, everybody. So Dow's have the same potential trap, you know, maintaining alignment and sustainability of values is In my opinion, probably one of the most important things. Abdel culture because well, they're also more fluid. I mean, when one of the conflict resolution is, Rage quitting, right? I mean, that is not a bug in my opinion. I mean, it's one of those things was like, look, if the values of this community, no longer aligned with who I am. And what's important to me. Then I can leave. I can choose that, right? And it, it's really
nice incentive alignment. It creates this nice accountability between the collective in the individual individual packs of doesn't want the individual to quit. So, individual minority opinions because of Rage Quit mechanisms, or we're having even just a market for in place for the doubt token. It actually holds the collective accountable to the individual and it's these incentive alignments that really need to be looked at with endow infrastructure. You know, I love my house, but actually I feel like they're in some
ways. It's cool to bootstrap some things with that, but I feel like the real power of dowes is the ability to An economy and actually have a a sustainable situation where you can actually issue currency to produce value, right? And end of the actual value of the currency is based on the value that you're coordinating. So if you can coordinate value-creation effectively, then people will want to participate in the system. And of course, the token engineering infrastructure needs to be designed with some forethought and having access to Tilton
engineering tools. Is another anybody's going to Wyoming next week. We're at producing Dow day on Friday and we're doing that to help out the Wyoming folks. Cuz they would like, one or two do a defy day and I'm like, why would she know you passed? Add a legislation at least do something like that? So we're helping him do that. Try to you know upgrade their cool factor is slightly. Thank you Ann. I'll be there. I'll be there and it's interesting cuz like their law didn't
touch tokens. All I did was create like a new organizational framework that you could be a down. There's a couple of things that are good and some other things that are not so good about the overall law. And it's like, I don't think they really understand that silly. Like what a dow is and what, you know, how we're building micro economy is initially monetary policy and the, you know, creating sustainable economic value, distribution mechanisms, and all of these different things, like no idea that this is what we're really doing. And I'm saying this on Livestream, so hopefully
they're washing and I'll pay attention. But yeah, I'm getting let's put it this way. Has anybody actually ever studied deeply Kenzie in economics and how monetary policies issued in the US and how screwed up that shit is. Think about when you're creating a doubt in a token, you're literally replacing the monetary policy of the United States in your little micro world. That's how serious what your building is. It will blow your freaking mind when you spend time thinking about that because we're literally.
Decentralizing the issuance of currency in micro condoms. Were, we get to determine the owns that the value of these. These communities on our own terms? This is literally never been done in a modern society, feudal societies, and all sorts of stuff that we could get into the history. But like, where this is going, is insane. So having good and sound. Almost first principles of token engineering and like monetary policy issuance and governance around this. And this is really complicated stuff is like phd-level stuff in my opinion and it's some of its well
above my pay grade. And I spent a Dozen Years studying this stuff. So like it's insane and like it's a lot of fun. But the gravity of what we're doing and the responsibilities that we have to do this stuff smartly and thoughtfully is like a whole another bar that I don't think that we think about probably enough when we're just kind of doing this. But what do you think about? I want to rip on that. It when you think about how government actually fun to public goods cuz governments are the number one funder of public goods are the only ones really doing it
sustainably nonprofits are the other option. Right? So generally what governments do is they actually use issuance to fund public goods. And there's this idea that taxes are paying for. Roads and blah, blah blah. Maybe sometimes occasionally, but really most of the money that governments use is just printed, right? Like 21 trillion dollars and Dad or whatever it is. Now, they didn't they didn't, you know, you taxes for that money right? That they issue that money. So they use issuance to fund public goods. It's a model that works.
I mean, we actually enjoy a lot of public goods for the, you know, fucked-up nature of governments and all that. You know, we're doing pretty well, so we can actually change that starts with. Oh, there's a, the governments have this Monopoly on, every public has vertical, but here we're actually going at, instead of top-down, we're going from the bottom up, are people who are on the ground and have the incentive to get things. Right can actually start coordinating value production through issuance and actually fun these public goods, fun, these
funding systems. But it's complicated, you know, this is not simple and honestly, we're in a golden age. Where up until this point every economy has never been designed has been designed by a couple people in a back room. Right? Like, who voted to raise the interest rates, you know, these are actually we have these systems that are designed by a few people in back rooms. We actually haven't really evolved into a bottom-up economic design, and it would kind of like what other people are,
too stupid, to design economies, right? And that's what the monarchy used to say. I think people are smart, especially the people in the house so we can actually play because they're open-minded. They're, they're willing to like, you know, Escape the normal normalcy and I just want to invite people in the token engineering. Commons. We're going to do this for Brooklyn collaborative economics, which is a very much, an educational opportunity to design a bonding curve conviction. Voting application in a dowel called Alfred Enoch, tal voting and, and actually have a
steam in and all this stuff from the bottom up. Anybody can actually designed the system. Is this really beautiful dashboard? They get to play with right? And then was funny as we have political debates, right? So people will propose the economy cuz guess what, when you're collaborating over shared resources, politics gets involved, and not the politics like the the evil politics that you think just like, you know, like the Greek word like politics. I'm going to take it. We're talking about Dow's. if you're interested in Dallas, like really, Thomas Hogan engineering, Commons
find somewhere to really get into economics. Nobody majors in the Yukon and the econ, we get taught in colleges in the Yukon that you are burned. So get involved in this stuff because in order to really understand the demands of how humans were late in Dows, how Economic Policy affects outcomes, how sustainability is impacted by different decisions. That might be engineered into the constructs of a doubt or some sort of issuance of a token. The only way to like really contribute meaningfully is that actually take the time to learn
it. The only way to learn it is to actually get involved in communities that can actually give you the knowledge. I honestly wouldn't have I wouldn't even know where else to put you. If you wanted to really know about Dows and learn about economic Game Theory, designed like, where would I send you like YouTube? You can't learn this stuff on YouTube. It's just not there. So, the Tec is, is a great place that gives you kind of a choose-your-own-adventure. In fact, I have a, she just left, but I have an exchange in my home
and she joined the GC because she in college, like, studied a little bit economics. Bad. No idea about any of this. And now, she's like, she's going back to Brazil. Feel like she's literally going to be building a house from, you know, half way south of us. And it's really cool because there's literally no barriers to learning this and it's very fluid and Hands-On. And I can't think of a better place to like get involved in learning about the house. So later, we raised 1.5 million dollars and you can design the economy. It goes into dope if you want.
I'm going to go back to the critical infrastructure and and tell a little story about the Dow. So back, actually. Cuz I was part of the locket team to that created, the Dow and the Dow Jones. I'm sorry about that. But, you know, anyway, before we launched the last piece that actually delayed, the launch was figuring out how the hell do we get money from this? Like, weird for smart contract thing into a German company's bank account. And that was that was the last piece.
Before we launched the. There should have been other pieces. Let smart contract out, its didn't exist the living with eight-month-old. Give us a break, you know. But I happen to be on stage with someone who's, like, saving the day on this because there's it's been a pain in my ass for five years. Trying to do the full Dowell, like paying people in crypto and the default answers. I okay. So like, hey, thanks for the dire. Thanks for the Youth. But what do I do? How do I pay taxes? How do I do any of this is like
with the dolly created, the Swiss entity called a link that would take money from the Dow and then the Dow link that link the Swiss entity had a tax ID and then it would be a middleman for every transaction, right, in that was the solution in 2016 and my other work, who knows. But now we have something way better, which is opolis, which I think is super cool. And I basically direct anybody in the states to this because it's just a ready-made solution. I don't know if you want. How about a little bit?
I don't mind Shelly, please. So for anybody that doesn't know my background, I spent twenty years in a shark attack in employment systems. So, in a previous life, I was, you know, modern-day slave holder. You could said, build, a big staff staffing company, and I extracted value from people who worked hard hourly. And I don't have a bunch of money and I had an existential moral crisis. You could say several years ago, and I decided basically that I was going to democratize employment. So, I walked away from pretty much everything that I sold my company, parlayed it into
the future, which of the future of work as we call which is opolis topless operates as the bridge between webtoon webtoon. What it really does is it creates legitimacy for those working at the early? So if you're trying to replicate your employment, experience with the Safety and Security accoutrement, a health care, and retirement plans, in my W2. So I can refinance my house and all these things opolis, basically, provide, you all of that without having to give up your independent. So you don't have to be subjugated to a corporation. You don't have to, you know,
get permission from some of the third-party entity the community, it's an employment down with the legal rapper. So we use a limited Cooperative Association on a Colorado to actually use the EIN number of that entity on behalf of the community to employ each individual through that entity, provide them all the services. There's a bunch of legal mumbo-jumbo stuff that we use. As far as like the co employment Outsourcing and what not. But essentially, most of our early adopters are down. People that are floating around if they really, they got a half, a dozen. Revenue streams are
getting paid in crypto. They have no idea how to get the stuff to their bank account. So we've created all the plumbing for that, so they can bring their payroll invoice to us and crypto. We convert it. There's no additional fees when we do a direct deposit, just like, your paycheck would be normally into your bank and it feels like a normal things. So if any of y'all have spouses that, I don't understand any of this crypto stuff and they're freaking out because you don't have group health care, plans, or whatever he have access to all of that paychecks in your, in your bank
account. Just like normal. If you want crypto, do that to we help with all the tracking basis statements, everything that you need so that you can just focus on what it is that you do. And so legitimizing people that work in the space is one thing. But if you think about it, there's only one activity that everybody does commercially and that's employment payroll. We're building the giant Bridge To The Future. So as the trend of Labor is already moving back to the independent worker. It's estimated just in the US
by 2028 90 million us workers will be classified as independent. What are they going to do? All this stuff is traditionally orbiting around the corporate employment subjugation like Healthcare in the US. What are you going to get it? What you going to do for your time, with plants? You can Cobble all this together on your own know, you're not. All of this is moving back to like the independent worker. So we're just poised to basically bring the next million people who crept out to Dad's house so that you don't have to like hold your nose and
jump in the lake with cement shoes on. You can actually have the infrastructure that you need to have a soft landing and you can just come right into the community is easy to do. So. Yeah. I mean, I'm basically a bum who lives in a van down by the river, you know, like I don't need, I don't need opolis the Chris Farley. I've been able to just kind of live fine off tripped over. That's not normal. And I have people at work with me who they want to buy a house. They won't need to get him or send he'd income. They can show up and
stuff. And so, and it was so nice. I actually do like Joshua. I don't know if he's around like, my, my friend just went to Josh and he Held held her hand all the way through and they opened up a LLC in Wyoming, be their own personal thing. And it was all so simple and easy. And we were worried. We are going to start like a Swiss entity or something. We're going to try to figure out how to do it on our own and it is such a waste of our time and it was so nice. Thank you. I really appreciate that. Vision of opolis do is more than just a
US base employment mechanism. Just everybody knows the goal is to build the global public utility infrastructure for employment. So anybody can plug-in from anywhere in the world connect with any Zhou, any Revenue stream that you want paying whatever damn currents. Do you want and have that normalcy in fluidity to work from where with whom and how much the fuck you choose? The whole subjugation of employment. If you think about it employers are the ultimate intermediaries. They're the ultimate third-party. Intermediary is the ultimate extractors of value. Not that they won't
have a place. Service, consumers will always exist. It's just a Dynamics. We're moving to a reciprocity, based employment relationship Dynamic versus the subjugated one. And so, we're building the infrastructure to do that. We're going to scale a globally. So not just uspo like right now us people have access to it. We're very soon, going to be in Canada and Puerto Rico, then we're going to Europe and then we'll be just doing all sorts of crazy stuff so it can be a lot of fun. So, yes, you do understand why they asked me to do the critical infrastructure stuff. Of course, I'm like, yes, I
love talking about this because I don't see a future for the house, unless we give people the keys to their commercial experience, unless they have the ability to choose their own adventure and handle, all the regulatory stuff, all the compliant stuff, all the tax stuff and all the necessary evil crap that we all have to deal with it unless we're providing that it's never going to happen. So I'm going to change the subject because yeah, they just gave me a big smile and looking into his eyes and I'm just like you are pretty cool. Infrastructure is critical
infrastructure. And I see Scott, I saw Scott around here and there's a cat hurting. Her name is critical infrastructure in Dows and it's and it's not you know, you have these public chat room. Hey, everybody vote at the comments just right there. No one's going to bother, I ask someone else. What do I? Hey, did you go down there tonight? Yeah, I will poke you. No, but seriously having these one-on-one like someone who's going to carry the flag for important steps to make sure that they follow through
is is really critical infrastructure and built-in. There's so much a sumption that people will just do things, you know, but actually you need someone to be a champion of almost every piece that you do the organizing that kind of work is it is really critical and there's people like the other in the space that that do really well and I think I made out kind of need someone. Yeah. Meet me at Community, Builders are critical for Dallas. If you don't have somebody evangelizing, your community on an active basis, like I'll give him that. I'll give another shot. Josh. Will it be 20 x? Joshua? Where
is he at? Do you still need someone around? I'm back in the bag. So Joshua, I'm fortunate enough to be able to work with him on a daily basis. We work like on three different projects together. But opolis is our core Focus. One of the best Community Builders in the space. So like you have to have it. If you don't have it find one filled one, bring one into the space, whatever you got to do, but having quality Community, folks for your dad, you won't, you won't go far without it since around the time. I just want to speed through another one at its reward, systems reward systems
are critical infrastructure, and it's very difficult to get right. There's lots of really cool tools out there according to a really awesome Source cried, of course as it has a good flow. There's a praise system. And then you know, there's no such as basic salaries, you know, paying hourly wages these sorts of things, you know, I know it's like not as cool as coordinator, but in the end that's what get stuff done and like, organizing these sorts of payment structure. I'm actually planning them out and getting them approved and and building the systems around making it easy. So someone
can come in and have a a dowager knee, right where they are. Just a passive contributor. Then all the sudden. They earn some down tokens by doing something and maybe they didn't even know. It was going to happen. And I love the what metagame has done is a is a really nice little on voting system and then make it fun and make it make it like you're a player, you know, and then you get some tokens and I know you got those tokens from selling become a patron, you know, plant your seeds in the balancer. But it's really critical to have this
incentive alignment. So so actually reward the people who are doing good work, and make it easy, you know, the experience is sustainable for the individual contributor. I think one of the things that we see in dowse's, they're not being compensated. Enough intangible like, Like, present-day funds to be able to continue. So you've got it a line, your game design with both the present and the future for sustainable contribution. If you're not doing that, go to the economics Channel, go to the Tec, learn a little bit more about economic game design, and Build it.
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