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  • Description
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About the talk


About speakers

Jules Miller
Partner at Mindset Ventures
Mathias Ruch
Founder, CEO at CV VC
Mikael Hajjar
General Partner at P1 Ventures
Ian Balina
Founder and CEO at Token Metrics
Lexi Novitske
General Partner at Norrsken22

Jules is an investor, 3-time entrepreneur, corporate executive and ‘intrapreneur.’ She is Partner and US Lead for Mindset Ventures, investing in seed - Series B enterprise tech startups, and splits her time between Nashville, TN and New York, NY. Previously Jules co-founded IBM Blockchain Ventures, launched and ran two IBM Blockchain Accelerators with Columbia University and was head of the IBM Blockchain Garage for North America. Prior to that she was a partner at LunaCap Ventures, a venture debt fund investing in diverse founders, and was COO of gender lens investing pioneer BRAVA Investments. Jules co-founded and led two legal tech companies: Evolve Law (acquired by Breaking Media/Above the Law), a digital media and events company for legal innovators, and Hire an Esquire, a venture-backed tech startup providing attorneys on-demand to law firms and in-house legal teams. She also founded Carbonado Group, an environmental sustainability consulting firm, and spent 7 years as an ‘intraprenuer’ helping companies including EY, Salesforce.com and Tiffany & Co. to launch and grow new business units around environmental and social responsibility. Jules earned her BA from UCLA and her MSc from The London School of Economics. She is a Kauffman Fellow and an EIR at 500 Startups.

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As a serial entrepreneur and investor Mathias Ruch has been involved in the digital startup scene for 20 years. Founder and CEO at CV VC (previously Lakeside Partners), a next generation investment company, where cutting-edge blockchain technology meets traditional venture capital. Co-Initiator of CV Competition, Europe’s largest Blockchain startup contest and Co-Founder of CV Labs, a co-working space and Blockchain incubator. Before turning his focus to blockchain, he built and exited several successful online and media companies such as FaroTV and Europe’s crowdsourcing pioneer Atizo. Mathias has co-founded the Swiss Blockchain Federation, where he serves as a Board Member and Chairman of the Expert Council. He is a driving force behind the development of the global blockchain startup ecosystem.

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Ian is the founder and CEO of Token Metrics, a data-driven cryptocurrency investment research platform that helps retail investors leverage analytics and machine learning to become better investors. He has appeared in The Wall Street Journal, Forbes, CNBC, Huffington Post, The Street, INC and Entrepreneur Magazine for his work in analytics, cryptocurrencies, and entrepreneurship.

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Play status in Tamil. Any business starts with investment, whether it's Angel, private-equity and venture-capital, or even just plain old people were talking about investment strategies for Nova Scotia who is managing partner with a cutie Venture Partners accelerator as well. Who is the CEO of cvd? See what are key Partners forever to watch a movie. We would also like to welcome. The couch was a managing partner with P in bovina, who is the founder and CEO of token metrics sedan.

I'm thank you everybody for joining me. I was invited to join as a member of this panel, but because I am certainly not a blotchy next where I asked if I could instead be the mall so I can learn something. I would love all of you to, please introduce yourself talk about where you're based. And of course I'm why you're relevance this topic, but you go first. Thanks for adding me Lexie. I am Jules Miller. I am a partner to find coal mines, adventures and bass in the US between Nashville, Tennessee and New York, New York. I have been in my

current phone for about a year. We do Enterprise investing so enterprise software, including blockchain and then prior to that. I was at IBM where I ran the black inventors group and lunch to lunch and accelerators was Columbia University. So I'm focused exclusively on Enterprise blockchain. So that's my spend on the world, but happy to be here and share some bus. Thank you, Ian or research company. Also working on a book called the complaint Western guide. That pretty much is an investor in football Traders and investors

and also the partner of turkey vultures. Excellent. Thank you. And Michelle. Chemical, I'm born and raised in West Africa, start investing in crypto, but, five years ago, we set up a v c sharp and repeating testing in Africa, for the past like 18 months or so. We haven't deployed capital in crypto. Just hit, between actively monitoring investment opportunities in the space, and I'm thrilled to be here. Great. Thank you, Miss. Aya. Thanks for having us at like, see my name is Matthias. I am founder and CEO of

cvvc pass for crypto Valley venture company with two special. T's number one is being rest. In blockchain companies, only showing the brakes and shovels of the space. They are two applications. Not the protocols, not the cryptocurrency program out of this year, that will happen Highbridge because it's a global program, only 10% of the deal flow assist. The rest is international including Africa, by the way, early stage. I appreciate it up to, I appreciate the 8th. We're on our own

operational business, which is to seal a business that is consisting of corking Hobbs in in Switzerland. Inn in zukin 421 in to buy, this is our International rollout strategy. Through this house were looking into South Africa right now. Hopefully, that will be launched very soon and Southeast Asia. At the very moment. We are organized conferences. Charlotte events record for the crypto Valley that so pissy report. This may be something. Some people know about the development here in

the in Switzerland. And you can't roll anymore about how Africa is embracing blockchain. Great. Thank you. Sorry, I'm just switching to my other device Basin Lego. So having a bit of Internet issues as is the norm, but maybe just a quick introduction for me as well. I am the founder and managing partner of a cutie Venture Partners where in early-stage investment firm that focuses only on africa-based in Lagos, Nigeria. Our first fund had two companies like Haystacks letter wave Migos smile. I dd-don't a seed

companies that I've really now become the gross stage cover stories of the African continent. And our second son is very actively deploying a primarily in anglophone West Africa, but also quite active this cycle and Egypt, East African francophone West Africa. Time. We certainly have looked at a lot of blockchain focus business models and would actively like to invest. But as I'm still learning myself, I can't read I say that I'm an expert. So I'm really excited to hear from all of you. Maybe my my first question, if I can just jump in,

may be first to Ian and me because you're, you're also very focused on the African continent, and then I'd like to hear maybe some more Global views as well. What are the most exciting use cases that you're seeing that are most relevant for or blockchain? Within Africa. Jen, would you like to go first? So so I was going to probably be gone. But the last two times I've been to your Ganda and asking General during or after control to work the two main use cases were sitting in the black and purple space for one exchanges surf. Example, when we had an event in Nigeria, it was very tough

for people to just even get exposure to bitcoin and being able to have a Fiat on-ramp because they look at you and see the naira has just been pretty much blacklisted in so many different parts of the world, that is very tough for even a honest. Athentic business owner to try to really become part of the global economy and higher developers overseas and Bitcoin with Julia way towards doing that. So had the pleasure of meeting at an exchange down there, to exchange payments. If you go to East Africa and plus, I had been very, very popular and they've been lots of companies in

the blood moon, phase, Tomorrow, that's a model but for the blockchain and Puerto Rico system, so those are the two biggest cases I've seen in Africa. Thank you. Yeah, yeah, just to build on that Lexie. I think we've seen him in just to double-check maybe on on, on both sat on payments. I mean, for those of us that travel and live on the continent mean, you probably can testify that it takes several days to settle a transaction that cut across Africa. Usually, like a minimum of three up to ten or twelve days and the fees range from like 3 to double-digit percentage

in asean was mentioning on an F on an off-ramp from crypto to see a transaction standards. It's at a fraction of the cars. And so we've seen definitely like Kryptonite changes like my coins and other bits of guy you were mentioning cootie take off African consumers. And Nigerian in particular. I think it's another country where they've seen the value of storing money in the form of cooked to So because of the domestic type theater and see if attrition list the models to cook to

exchange can be lounge. And then I think as long as you have a critical mass of buyers and sellers that dirt about 50 crypto exchanges across Africa 15 of which were like Lounge. Just like two or three years ago Remains the largest market if I'm not mistaken and then South Africa would be S. And we've seen early signs of success. So, like, I think there are over 1.4 million people on some sort of crypto. That's the world's largest penetration over, 1.01%? Trading volumes are traits of a Leo, but when you normalizing current GDP per capita, it's one of

the highest in the world in Nigeria thing is is the largest country. We've seen some indication of cancer. Crypto exchanges, more specifically, telling the first topic on crypto exchange. Luna was founded in 2012, was bought last year, another station. And they are some interesting Trends. We're seeing a treaty between the two that you mentioned in between oil changes and payments. We've sent Racine solve crypto exchanges consumer-facing companies, like corn direct or B bass up.

That started to shift and pivots over the past few years, to your ward, more like, Enterprise cross-border payments. So very interesting work. A lot between those two. Yeah, and maybe for that, the rest of you who've looked globally and in Africa as well, but also maybe if you have seen some interesting, the most interesting use cases, especially for other emerging markets, that might be applicable for Africa that you have seen, or maybe that are still yet to come. I'll just say that

defy in general is going to be interesting and every every market so there's going to be local nuances of what's relevant and what being used. So for example in the US we look at payments as well. But we're more looking at cross-border, find it. No trade Finance. I'm looking at payments within gaming, things like that. So our markets a little bit more mature, but we're still looking at payment switches with different different, use cases in applications or sometimes in the case of trade Finance in cross-border payments. It's pretty Global and there's a real need for that. I think we're

not really looking at exchanges as much in the us but we are looking at Market places or things like open see which are very specific Market places for things like in a fifties and collectibles on which was just just raised 23 million led by Andreessen Horowitz for me. Looking at the Enterprise space. I look at, you know, the broader category of digital assets so that can be money that can be tokenizing things like stocks and bonds or real estate. But then also what we've been looking at a lot of intellectual property. So can you take Nystatin? Can you took a nice things that people own?

And This includes nephews in Arden Sports and Collectibles and all that, but it's a much broader category than that in my opinion. Because there is a lot of things especially in the Enterprise that you can. You can assign value to and need to be tracked along the way. So one of the companies that was in my IBM blockchain accelerator, caught up, I pee wee is doing it. The company that this year's actually in France, that they're, they're pretty Global and they are using their tokenizing. Be are there, putting the IBM patent portfolio, which is the largest in the world on blockchain and

tracking it and monetizing it in different ways that a lot of really interesting use these cases that start with an asset and I can be a financial asset. It can be non financial asset Tracking not around the world is really interesting and I think again these cases are similar. They're just lightly they replied slightly differently in different different markets depending on the maturity and depending on the local news. Absolutely. I can fit in my check for what you're saying. I chose referring also to more mature markets. Probably if I look at our field flow with

roughly screen, two to three thousand projects a year, for both the incubation programme as the direct Investments, as I said, 90% Global decent amount off of Emerging Market deal for including but also including a bit from the US UK less these days rest of Europe, so much. That's why we also want to type into into southeast Asia between Emerging Markets, right? So Africa's going to be first on our plate. Roughly two-thirds of the Jews cases and rakes and shovels. Application Services based on blockchain. Technology

industry. Only one third. Is known for national service. Probably also they claimed most of your experiences in the space. Our thesis based on the fact that, you know, the growth in the space is driven. By Rachel is driven by crypto historian, by exchange payments. Would you have just mentioned right? And it snows institutional, great Solutions will will will follow to bring some troubles Solutions in the space, will grow over proportionally in in the time or in the, in the future. Where our Focus lies. Now, when it comes to use cases for Africa, I

mean Frozen in First World situations, you know, we go to ATMs, we use the credit cards. We have bank accounts, if you buy a house, if you file, and we are sure that I can own the land that the previous owner is is entitled to, to actually sell it, which is different in all the emerging markets that we have just been discussing. So very basic, Financial inclusion, reduction of cost for trust but also up to impact Investments. If I look at the current portfolio, I think we have three or four

African startups. I want is one is in and the area of impact investing kind of two large companies. When it comes to also measure impact investments. In other one is electricity for kids with an app that teaches them about math and pans and financial m Basic know how a third one is now everything towards defy. So that's B echoing what you said? So I think there's many very interesting use cases that machine. Maybe all of you, especially the ones that have been

busy, looking at the broader Market, as well as a means for some of these consumer-driven, like, crypto exchanges. For example, I imagine a lot of the metrics that you're looking at on engagement is, is quite similar in volume, and all of that, but when you're especially may be looking at some of the non-financial aspects or or maybe this is relevant to some of the financial use cases, as well. How are you looking at these companies differently? How are you sassing? They're at their viability. And how are you also doing to diligence on the text? And I'll just

leave it open for anybody to jump in. I can jump in cuz we have a we had some lessons learned on this. That was my fun. We we initially tried to do blocks and Deals the same way we were doing our other deals and that doesn't work. We had to pretty quickly. Recalibrate and so it doesn't work for a lot of reasons but one because we usually we typically invest in series a deal. So we look for a certain Financial threshold of like how of revenue for example, like usually is about a millionaire, are the blockchain companies that are doing deals in the range were doing, which is usually

somewhere between like a five and a 30 Million Dollar Round. They usually don't have a lot of Revenue and so there's and then the diligence is also very different. The technical diligence is more important. Sometimes the less important sometimes depending on the east coast and depending on the product itself and sometimes was outsourced to an expert and sometimes will do diligence and how, but I think the the other thing that's really different is less about dilijan is more about how you deploy Capital. So, instead of doing kind of a million million, have to check with his article

check size for our normal deals with blockchain, we The new the new thesis of doing a lot of smaller checks and much much earlier. And then when things are working you doubled down on them, that is a very big shift in philosophical investment strategy, then our typical fund. So you're not a blockchain only investor. It's sometimes really hard to do a line, the blockchain deals with what your other investment pieces, in your other investment processes. And so, you really just have to rethink and do what's right for the black female because there were when I kept ringing watching

Del Sol table, there were like three or four instances where, you know, normally would take probably 3 to 4 weeks for diligence, which is relatively fast for a series, a deal and what the blockchain deals if we didn't do it in a week we lose the deal. And so you just have to just consider the different nuances of the of that particular market and do things a little bit differently and get Comfort. Like we had to go get approval from your investment Committee in our NRL NRL Packer Linda partner by the council just to be able to do that and have everyone by ends up took a little bit of

time. But when we, when we are all in the same page, it works a lot better. Matthias, did you want to come in? Sure, sorry, so we are wearing the space since 2016 and on Whip and focusing on the bricks and troubles approach ever since basically, so maybe that's maybe a bit different. I was saying the tickets, I still sign speed and everything like that. So all of our investments have been Play Manila Equity Investments. If I, if I'm not mistaken, right, so, even though we can invest and talk and salsa from the front side of things. All of our investments have been equity-based incubation

program. Prerequisites, that you have a corporate structure that began Investing. For example, of course, that we are open. If you have told him, I was linked to these Equity miles beyond return. To that many token, only ideas or ideals or whatever. They are called nowadays, even though he find a space for the moment is of course, the only thing, right? So this is content transfer for us. The selection process in the incubation programme is the 7-step process with

lots of picture. You did the founders. It's very expensive. The problem is, of course, that's I have a nickel right now. Problem with you. Within creation program, the stage that we are focusing is in such cases is a limited amount of time that skis companies. They grow fast and sometimes you lose them because it takes time until we have spent all the application and they don't fit your incubation program anymore. Right? So then we will switch to be selecting investment. That something that happens. But we still spend a lot of time with the founders and we have a lot

of experts here. We are here. Running an incubation Astoria co-working space with over a hundred, fifty bucks in startups that are based out of his location. So you have a lot of tears and you have kind of also am a venting system here. If, if new projects come to switch, you hear about these projects and investing cause quite a stir, I have to stay until we have the technology technology, experts, that sometimes I needed something, or we can take Drinks, that we need to. I'm just probably into it when other question and I'd like to hear from from

all of you, on your firm's, or your personal philosophy on investing and token is, do you have a policy that enables that and or or not? And why? Or why not? I'll do for us. We're pretty much tokens only, we have made a few at the Investments but over 95% of our investments and we think token economy and ecosystem is really the future, and I think it's supposed to just easier as an investor being able to have an option in terms of your investment. Now, without symptoms of doing, the do do the due diligence behind quickteller assets. We typically like to First go through

what we call panty wetter, Nelson Has a Field value investing approach has been going to the requirements of the teams background and making sure there's no science to any. Do any potential bad Investments like to follow that up by doing an in-depth interviews. So very rarely do. We do it down into a project without having a chance to actually go through the code. So having a luncheon and dinner is go to the club. Miss me doing our own internal audit to make sure his actual sword technology. So I would say we do like doing early and sage and busting. But

in terms of dumb down and going deep into any particular project, you would like to make sure the code is solid based on research team. Not interesting. Then we can invest in tokens with our current find. And so again, it's it. We do. I put the only because that's the ogun where it where enterprise software Focus beefing about fifty million. What does third find that we have right now? And you know we can we could have there was a strong argument, you know, who would ever be so fun. You can kind of get away with doing things that are off pieces for about

20% of the fund, but we really do need to get clearance and get buy Informer, LP's, which right now we have made the case for you ever took in Investments were so focused on Equity investment. So at some point and you see several funds do this is, you know, they split up a fun between your Equity only and then tokens. And so that suspends, I think that, you know, they're for example, there's a sound that does Equity only with their existing funding and they have a separate actually off-balance-sheet investment, or investment pool of capital for the token. And what's been really

interesting in the space. And I don't think there's a clear answer, you have to build it into your thesis is, where is the value lie? And with some companies it might be a quickie with them. What is my feet as different people? Think the value is in different places and it's really hard to tell at the beginning of Dunn personal investment in deals. Where is in a partial tokenpocket, partial, partial equity. And the jury is out where you make money. I mean, I do think the liquidity of the tokens is really interesting. But that's also not the traditional ABC model, right? So it kind of goes

against the philosophically, you know, that the traditional PC philosophy of like, you know, long-term capital in inpatient capital. And I think that that is just something you need to have a like, real self-realization on his like, how do you want to be investing? Are you, you know, are you and what are you good at? Right? Because the chicken dusting tokens of very different type of investment philosophy and strategy and applications and investing in what would be considered typical venture-capital deals. I can't I can second that point as well jewels and my

crush without being. How did those Investments where you would have both equity and token? A location. Really work out right? Because I haven't seen that yet. So far. It's either you have the equity that turns out to be the thing that works or the token one as we seek alignment between the two. But to be honest, I haven't really seen that working out that well, so, even though people keep working on that on hand, and your initial question, you know, why white oak? Why what and what is special about investing into

our? Our prospective jurors is is also because we have been through the whole, i c, o price, which was really specific and in sweats. And we're near the first money went into into most projects that were based out of the valley. And me seen, I think we've screened in this early days. 16 17. And in six months, thousands of project at the Quality overall was so low. Lights out. You are a bit more. Yeah, maybe a skeptic when it comes to these new guys today. I'm not saying, of course you have an evolution into space

and everything is more mature. But sometimes at this is my opinion, the money you can make some token and through token fundraising it is a bit too easy, you know, and this is sometimes a bit reflected in the projects that we see. So ssss know as soon as you try to have a discussion around and do you have Equity, how do you link that talk about a proposition to the equity proposition, then the conversation becomes interested in most of the cases. Missing. So I'm want to shift gears a little bit. Probably more Irrelevant for me kehlani, and

there certainly are a lot of barriers that are hitting both of our crypto exchange companies in probably a lot of the, the blockchain solutions, like, around property registration or other maybe legal based solutions, that that might come into play. I want I want you to maybe address what you think are the barriers weather that's in Talent on finding a chain expertise, or regulatory risk, or if it really comes down to in, in some cases, maybe the maturity of the overall Industries and the ecosystem. Jordan, happy today that song and then let the end

and some of the points we had a vivid point, then, you know, blockchain and and cooked him a specific electric thing with Alan and I think, regulation, and compliance as far as we're concerned. Has been the most acute IP points in defy and Racine specifically, like, in in, in Nigeria recently revised General, your crack down on on crypto-currencies and that, that affected quite a bit, the development of some of the startups. Although it's, it's, it's I can you look at the broader set of

African ecosystem? Lemon. It's exciting with what's happening. If you feel like there, You know, they are Regulators, like Ethiopia for instance, that have been a much more Progressive approach with the Ministry of Education, working with that guy, Cardona program in one of the teachers that will eventually get those digital ID. And then we'll be tracked through the Battle of prison. So in a sense that is, is changing pretty fast to Talent, still feeling some pain, but changing slowly and

and have some light at the end of the tunnel. I think security maybe another one last one. I think, you know General specific he went when he comes to like find a job application like a trip to our highly exposed to say about that. Phantom hackers, and that's another one where another of the years that that we should keep in mind or that's probably a global one. And I'm not sure if you have anything in particular, you that resonates the Block in ecosystem. In Africa, has been there on business trips. But from people I've met their out. Say one would be

just really getting the the government's they're on lunch in a cup. Tell tell him that this is not a scam. And then also dealing with past scams like one, another is that people have had to deal with the point where now, it makes it tougher and more challenging for, for genuine block. Tina Turner has to try to really do something in Africa because now you have regulator to do, you understand it? And think, maybe you could tell us, can definitely a challenge ever in the world even more. So in Africa, as well.

And we could come there or just educate them there. And then I was also Capital. Then give it to have, more investors, more more more will be seized in Africa and investing in projects there. And I think when you have more watching and crypto successful stories Coming Out of Africa, then you let you have, even more Capital flowing down there. Yeah, I certainly agree. But I wonder if to be successful and and probably could do exchanges aren't necessarily as relevant or payments companies, but I want her to be successful investor in a lot of black Chain

Solutions. You need to be a specialist. So you need to be first a specialist of the African garment and then of the solutions in the technology themselves, but maybe I'm wrong. I'd like to hear if you guys think that might be the case. I don't think so. I mean, I think you definitely do need somebody who is a specialist. If anything. I think it makes more sense to team up with people who are already specialist. And whatever reason, your weather is in East Africa, West Africa, South Africa, North Africa, and then slowly over time to help that expertise by working

alongside them. If I could. I think it's we like to work. I really closely with the the few Specialists and advisers that actually very similar to what Jewels were saying. I think another approach we may end up just to basically. Revise accordingly are at Investments due diligence process to get smaller checks faster and just learn quicker. Think it's a great way to build additional knowledge about Sabbath cryptic and along with the course investing in the points that they would be specifically the

the ones that has like a value-add to go to Kohl's. Nike theory on text about the Cordoba work others that have potential for more use cases and just steps going value that big point. Take. It's really sad that it's really a bit. Also, from a government perspective. If you look at this movement, or this technology Revolution, like, like, if you look at it, like an entrepreneur, right? So you have, I think you have two choices. You develop yourself. Or you wait until something has

developed. And you, you, you buy it, right? And because it's happening anyways, and you can kind of really, it's like the people who said, when is Facebook going away, right? And, and a lot of people know, it's never going to go away and lock in technology and digital currencies are cryptocurrencies. Maybe it's the same, even if it's just another use case of what it's supposed to is that you have to educate and the ecosystem, right? Because you are in a different development,

stage 2016 17 basement. After when you were talking about blockchain, it took you And darkness basically, right? That's all you could discuss with the card to bitcoin. You couldn't discuss. Use cases that has changed a bit now. And use case is that are non Financial base. There are good door opener for government. And when we when we were approaching our, our Africa initiative by the partnership has partnered with a Swiss state Secretariat score for economic Affairs. For for economic development, in order to be able to also tackle everything that's related

with the government's from regulatory perspective, education and everything. Because at some point you will end up discussing these things anyways, right? So and that's the partnership that we have the building. I'm talking to local governments, besides actually. Just trying to invest in the most promising companies on the couch. I would just jump in and say that I agree with the end. You don't have to be an expert and actually would take it to the next level and say no one's actually an expert. Besides, you know, if you go especially outside of the cryptocurrencies that have been around for

several years. There is no real winners yet, right. You can't be an expert. If you haven't had a big way in and we're still at a very early stage of maturity, in the market, in a lot of people use cases. So what people might say there? Are they really, you know, I think that there's just not enough of a track record in the industry is still too immature to actually have those experts. What you do need is to have enough understanding of what you're doing to do not make stupid decisions. Right? And so I think that's not necessarily expertise. That's just kind of managing risk. And so you

have to know it's not too kind of know how the pieces on it, but then you know, you can become and this is a beautiful part of any emerging industry, especially if you can become an expert pretty quickly or what was considered an expert in the market by making a couple of Investments. You learn really, really quickly by putting some money down and working with a couple of company. So for example, me in a few space, no one was An expert at first, if you have two or three Investments. Now, Indiana to space all the sudden you're an expert in that can happen within six months, right? So it

is it it I think the question is what is an expert and I don't think they're really any true experts in the same way. We have like Ben Tankard Health Tech experts in the other areas that we invest in with our fun and you have to get comfortable with that. You have to come for putting on Capital in areas that you feel a little bit less comfortable with your personal expertise and actually the expertise of the people. You're no calling for diligence and and bringing in to help evaluate the deal. Because there's just so much uncertainty and so much newness to the space. That you know, you

have to use your. It's more about managing downside risk and managing the fact, I like you like a sandwich. Is this note is the code good. Is the is the team good. Is there any weird? Like fraudulent activity, or sketchiness to the deal? And that's pretty much the type of diligence we do. Whereas in and do we believe in the use case, in the end, the upside potential of it rather than some of the more Intensive diligently doing other sectors where we really do bring in experts have been working in the space and, you know, have seen wind over 20 years. That just doesn't happen to be

watching right now. I think we're about 40 minutes, and that was our time slot. So perhaps we maybe do a quick leaving, everyone would like one word of wisdom for investing watching and we'll see what she joins us again. If not, we'll wrap it up. Sounds good. I'll start, I'll just watching is is new with interesting is exciting. Put some Capital down. That's how you learn. I love it so much. I got back in just in time. Looks like our time is up. Lexi. We're just going around and giving all of the final word of

advice and suggestions for investing in blockchain. Auto auction and cryptos. The future money has not been in crypto. And this point is almost a financial crime, but start slow. You don't have to go out and just dip your toes. And as you get more comfortable with space, then you can invest even more. I like it. I just let you know what you were saying earlier, to remind me up like a back-road, Sam Reid, Hoffman that passed on Square D. I think sometimes you have

when you have domain expertise and you being in a specific field, like 10 Tech or like rushing this case or too long. You you miss out like she owned the most exciting opportunities to. I think exactly what Ian says, you play some Capital slowly, but surely and learn. I have two different messages for the level of development of the respect respective regions for emerging marches. I would save invest in blockchain because it's much more than technology and for the more developed economies. I will check Indians quote and I'd say it's the

future of capital markets. Great, but thanks for having us. Enjoy the rest of the bank you so much for hosting.

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938
bitmain, blockchain, crypto, cryptocurrency, fintech, fundraising, game, government, investment

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