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LA Blockchain Summit
October 12, 2021, Los Angeles, CA, USA
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Crypto Investing 2021 and Beyond
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About the talk


About speakers

Joe Vezzani
CEO at LunarCRUSH
Deepak Ghosh
Vice President/Head of Product & Design at Abra
George Kushner
CEO at H2cryptO
James Putra
Head of Product Strategy at TradeStation
David Grider
Head of Research at Grayscale Investments
Adam Draper
Founder and Managing Director at Boost VC Accelerator

Joe has an extensive background working in across finance, technology, advertising, sales, marketing, and start-ups. Since finding cryptocurrency in 2015 Joe has not looked back, a long-time hold’er he believes anyone building in the cryptocurrency space is building a better future.

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Deepak is the Director of Product at Abra, a global crypto wallet and exchange platform that enables users to trade, earn interest on, and borrow against cryptocurrencies – all wrapped into a single and easy-to-use experience. Prior to Abra, Deepak has led Product within the context of a range of spaces including consumer retail, telecommunications, foodtech, and fintech – with the singular mission to apply technology in ways that create unprecedented opportunity for humanity at scale.

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George Kushner has been in the Financial Services industry for more than twenty-five years and has sold Fixed Income Securities and Derivatives to some of the largest and most sophisticated investors in the world. Additionally, George spent over a decade dealing with High and Ultra High Net-Worth individuals investing in Alternative Investments. George has worked for storied firms such as Merrill Lynch’s Hedge Fund Development & Management Group, Permal, Man Group, BlackRock and Wells Fargo. Furthermore, George is extremely entrepreneurial having started two businesses in the past. George received a Bachelor of Arts (History) degree from Georgia State University and received his MBA from The Goizueta School of Business at Emory University. Finally, George has received his Certified Cryptocurrency Expert Certificate and his Certified Blockchain Expert Certification from The Blockchain Council.

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James helped launch TradeStation Crypto’s offering which utilizes a true online brokerage model that self-directed investors and traders have come to expect for equities, futures, and foreign currency markets. He is a reputed crypto asset specialist and blockchain thought leader focused on helping people find innovative ways to participate in this space. He is active in the blockchain community with speaking engagements, TV appearances and mentoring. James has over 15 years of experience in the Fintech industry.

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David Grider is Head of Research at Grayscale Investments, the world’s largest digital currency asset manager. In this role, he leads Grayscale’s research team, tracks the evolution of the digital currency ecosystem, and develops reports that educate investors and inform product development. Most recently, he was Head of Digital Asset Research at Fundstrat Global Advisors, where he oversaw emerging technology research within the blockchain, cryptocurrency, fintech and internet space. Previously, he was a founding partner at Aenigma, a digital asset venture capital fund and investment banking advisory firm. He has also worked in the Financial Instruments, Structured Products & Real Estate group at PwC performing investment valuation consulting. David began his career on Wall Street in 2012 at Noble Financial as a VP of Equity Capital Markets.

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Adam Draper is the founder and managing director of Boost VC. Adam is a 2x entrepreneur and a 4th generation venture capitalist. He also has a very large comic book collection. In 2009, the same year that Adam graduated from UCLA, he founded Xpert Financial, a secondary market for private securities. After settling millions of dollars in private security transactions and becoming a registered broker-dealer, he left Xpert Financial in late 2012 and began angel investing, where he backed such startups as Coinbase, Plangrid and Amplitude. Adam then partnered up with Brayton Williams and to change the face of global startup mentorship. The focus of Boost VC on future technology development stems from Adam Draper’s dream to create an Iron Man suit.

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Some amazing conversation so far. And I went into the future and he had to look up crypto, investing in 2021 page to cryptos, train station. Crypto, James, Putra Grace, got Investments, David Bridal, who's feces out of Dreyfuss and Luna crushes, Joe bazany. While wrote rolling in one by one. What's up everyone? Hello. Welcome to the 10:45 session at the LA, blockchain Summit, crypto investing 2021 and Beyond. I have a feeling we will be training towards to Beyond portion of that title. My name is Joe pisani on the CEO of luma cross. Just social intelligence company for crypto. And today, I

have the opportunity and pleasure of having a conversation with this fantastic group of individuals, love for you guys to do. Some introductions. We can start work. We'll just go out with a tackle first name Adam, Draper. Who are you? What do you do? How can see you too? I just want to say thank you to the blockchain summit. My name is Adam Draper on the founder and managing director of boost VC. I was the first investor in coinbase, which is probably relevant to this

panel off and then we also If you see where the first fun to focus on cryptocurrency, investing about 110 related crypto companies, which were rebranding as web3. I think now. So let's start saying what three instead of crypto or is that a topic? We should discuss a little bit. I mean, I mean, I've just been a huge fan of the people in this industry for a long time and Happy beer. Thanks, man, David popping over to you. Hey, everyone crazy here. I'm giving Ryder. I'm currently the head of research at grayscale investment risk of the largest digital currency asset

manager. In the world. I've been investing in and around the crypto ecosystem started getting in front of a 2015. And, you know, I've been very excited to talk to you all about. I think they were seeing in the Marquis de las Venturas, Deepak. Hi, thank you so much for having me here. I'm the got two products are real bro. And you have been involved in the Krypt for a while. Non-professional Erie, professional. This is my first contact with cooked. Super excited. Always been bullish on space. And yeah, I'm finally glad to be part of the welcome

George. Great, great setting there. It's all fake but don't look great. I can bang on everybody on the panel and everyone around the world. Looking nice to meet everyone. My name is towards Kushner and I am the CEO of H2 crypto, which is a next-gen cryptocurrency exchange and we have an impending. Launch. We're looking at my background is in a fact that I am a spy, a, I spent almost twenty-seven years and traditional dance and got a hold of Bitcoin and blockchain and DLT. Several years back, had the Epiphany house. Like, why am I in this business? I need to go to where the future is. So

hello to everyone. Welcome, and then James. Thank you very much for having this year. My name is James Petron VP of product over at churches in crypto features options and crypto all under one friend. I got involved in crypto. Probably how the heck did this happen after the first start watching. Thank you very much. That's awesome. Love train station. So I want to start, you know, we're going to get into some stuff. That's a little bit more. Kind of complicated when it comes to a kind of investing. But I did want to start with, you know, something a little bit more simple for everyone cuz

sometimes with investing, you know, we've got there's more folks that are new than our kind of veterans and so, you know, the question and we can kind of go around again is now, there's a new face of the holidays. This year. Could be anyone. It don't own any crypto yet. How do you introduce them in Enoch today in 2021 at this juncture? What do you say to them? When they say, I want to start investing in crypto Anatomy, kick us off again if you want. Yeah, in 2014. I bought my in-laws a

dick when was $500 or something? And so, I gave my in-laws Bitcoin in and then in 2 years, 3 years later. I bought them some aetherium, but one of us has like 20 and then giving money is your good good way of getting in. But I also have gone through phases of giving like cryptokitties, crooked, like, which it was much more difficult when there wasn't really a visual like wallet, where you could actually like visualize them, a shove, your new thing. I'm pretty sure I technically still own the cryptokitty again, with no one, no one like

claimed it and put it in their own wallet. So I genuinely think it's more. Great time to educate people. People who have recently, jumped ship to the, you know, the Dark Side of crypto right side. I don't know. Which side are we on? Are we on? Are We waking Dark Knight? What are the size of the side of the future of Finance? I like I saved those. People are going to have really great conversations. I've been the Bitcoin person in my family for too long, but that I don't think they want

to talk to me about it anymore. But the people who wear, that's a new conversation that's going to be a great way to educate everyone on what you're doing and why, because the markets do to develop so much as know. It's super exciting. So basically just giving them giving them some and saying, hey, follow this actually I should say is the the hot tournament in crypto and in virtual reality. So if you were the accelerator for Syfy, so we invest in The the things that would be really interesting that are like the future to give away would-be

Oculus headset and then decentraland property. So those were both be very interesting things to give away. That no one would really understand for another five years, which I think is my purpose in life. Very cool to put on the Oculus, get into the Central and, you know, by your land and you're good to go and then start selling some stuff. He created David interested to hear your take on. What's the first thing that you tell someone? Is it go to skellytown? Cat gbtc. Is it going to be? How is it? Where where do you sit on that?

That I got access was really through gbtc, but then, you know, obviously if I was able to get it to that. I need to buy a little bit or just gift it a little bit. I just have to be a huge amount but I think that like the key and really getting kind of involved are doing is just a little bit of exposure. That'll get you interested in how this stuff works to research more. You'll figure out how it works. And transactions. Maybe you'll pop on 285. If you get, if you get in a

courageous enough, to do some transactions, buy some nfts, right, maybe go to the central and and, and in bought by something right now, I think the first step to kind of getting involved, maybe even getting into the community eventually go allocation and invite some interesting things, right? That maybe are Beyond Bitcoin. I think at this point, right? We're seeing a trend for our clients of investors looking to diversify. And, you know, like a dimension that be Central and that's one really interesting one that we know. We also brought around and we think that's that's

interesting as well. So those are the ways that I would recommend folks get involved. And they can do their homework and educate themselves as they go along from there at. And when they do that homework and educate themselves with like the aha moment with people that come back and they're like, holy shit. You were like, what is all this? They're coming back with the following questions. You see any Trends there? I mean, I've seen that when people start to use crypto and I think that we want, you realize, you know, how someone so you can send money over the Internet, how, how you really unlock,

like an entire internet economy, across the globe things you can do in seconds and fractions of the cost, the the different trust factors that you can have with someone. You don't know across the internet and e-commerce. Like I think, when is really when you get into actually using creeped out cuz I mean you can buy it, you can let you know vision of what the technology brings why the movement has value until you actually really experienced. It firsthand and become an active participant in the

economy or just outside investor know, you know, it's not, you know not doing it cuz you kind of really have a full understanding or someone told you. But you know, I think then that's when you actually have the conviction to really understand what you're investing in. No, to hold it for the long-term like Adam talked about and to know that you're really out of the curve or something. And I think that's probably your my view a good way to approach it that you're not, you're not really crypto. Investor until you've said 30 grand across a bridge and you go to either scan and it literally

says black hole. So until you tell you've done that, you're not really in what do you tell people, you know, when they're coming and how do you kind of get them on board it? Yeah, and then you basically Lauren and me trying to figure out what the risk profile public, I think at the very least. Typically look at the investment Horizon side. Probably not ask my dad to get into BTC right now and Some level of understanding of what the investment Verizon isn't, that where they are in their

life. It's all about, you know, allocating some amount of your portfolio to 100 + cook, Jose, that you can at least invested. So, so, do you know what, what their allocation strategy could be at what they risk profile as if they're so, you know how hungry they sing the charge. That sarahah moment like, oh my goodness. That chocolate insane. You do a little bit over the past. Like maybe 5, 8 years has something else to keep going. You know, I would probably recommend some little bit higher risk assets to put the money into if you're

not very excited and their quiet BCC, all the way, you know, it just depends on to the way they are. End the best. I could do to try to understand with the risk profiles and so on. And I'll let you know, if we could add him and David it's about going in learning and what you're investing in. So that's, that's pretty much what my my usual methodology yet. Do you have anything kind of outside of that that you were telling some of your friends? You know, look, I think that it's not least a little bit of common denominator with

several of the other panelists. Education is key. And again, having a very heavy background and Wall Street in capital markets. I think that the best cardinal rule of investing is make sure, you know, what you're investing in or at least a semblance of what you're investing in. And I think, or for me personally in my own going down the rabbit hole and understanding Bitcoin in in the whole kind of Cryptocurrency Universe. I wanted to start with the foundational basis. So what is blockchain, what is to be like your technology Automotive technologist in? Or do you have to be to be involved

in this landscape? I met somebody at a party or friend of mine comes up to me and I know anything about the space. I would say look up on YouTube. There's some very short videos on what is blockchain. What is distributed Ledger technology didn't look and see what is bitcoin's? You truly kind of understand what you're dealing with then. I would tell them to effectuate a small trade, buy some dick coin, try to meet there. And once you have it setup you have someone you trust, send some picture of a friend of yours in a wallet. Just so, you know how these processes work, but I honestly think

that the kiss technique, keep it simple. Stupid. Makes the most sense. Otherwise, you're going to lose people. Very, very fast is a complicated space to Bina. Yeah. It's a traditional Finance is already difficult. You know, I'm too crazy for for a lot of people even want to get into. And now we're throwing around things like decentralized, autonomous, organization and 70%. Stablecoin apy. So it's definitely got to go slow until I want to know, you know, what was your most recent investment? And what kind of diligence did you do on that? And,

you know, it in the space right now, there's a lot of projects that are on the market that are out there. There's a lot of private deals going around. There's Equity / token deals, token only deals like how, how are you looking at diligence when you're making a decision. And some of these deals that are moving around so quickly where it's allocations, just kind of Get shrunk down into the small amounts and how are you kind of thinking about that? So I'll ask the first question. I'm excited to actually be able to answer that question this year and not the hero God hears, this guy again,

everything we talked about all the time. Also. I've been right on the nail. Right on the head. My suggestion usually is picked by the $10 price, of a cup of coffee, just buy something. I'll even match your ten bucks. If you buy something. It's really like it in the game and start figuring it out to the next question about, where do we think about diligence? And how do we have different opportunities in the space? That's a very challenging thing in the crypto space, because, as you pointed out there so many unique opportunity and

stop, when I look at from my train station lens. There's probably 20 different paths. We can go to do investments in Greeley crate, really, important business. What I look at the kind of personal side. I look at what are the things I can do in my portfolio. And as a traitor, I look at everything really coming through that that lends. So, there was a cloud or Alive bar over there. I'm looking for love off my position. So what I did was I gave my kinda party. I started to look at what are the practices? Whose company? I dug into it. The contract terms are where my

applications were. My margin requirement. I didn't assessment of how much pain, I can withstand the trade one against me and I had to organize the Exit Plan, including, what would invalidate my thesis, and then I pulled the trigger. And that's sort of the basic framework, that I would go through for a just placing on any kind of trade, but also goes into any type of investment. We're going to do is a firm for any product and business line, and say, a new investment in another company. That would be complementary to our services. What is it? Like when you say there's something that could

invalidate your thesis? How often do you actually get out of that trailer? That other emotion? Sometimes it going like I was wrong it like that the ground has shifted underneath me. And you know, are you always going out when you know, that that kind of has hit or sometimes you let it ride, you know, I try to be as quick as possible, but I'm human and I get wrapped up so I think more often than not. I'm pretty mechanical on my decision, but there are few and it is very easy to fall in love with a trade, in an idea and not want to see. That's the end. I remember those

quite a bit. Usually, the result of painful loss. I try really hard up front to know what my game plan is, what I should expect it would invalidate, my thesis so that it's mechanical for me on that the backside of the trade. So stick to the plan. Adam. Do you stick to the plan? I can't even imagine you like the deal flow that you're saying, you know, from all sorts of angles. And and how do you kind of delineate crypto versus non crypto in and what kind of diligence are you doing? Well,

the first one is definitely a lot. But the when when I was talking to Brian Armstrong, I was at a coffee shop called Red Rock. I like giving Red Rock credit because if a couple massive companies from it, but the it's in Mountain View. You guys should try it out and hang out there Founders. So yes, I had never heard of Bitcoin. I never heard of digital currencies. And that was why I actually met with Brian and explain this whole like we're going to be on One Financial

infrastructure as a world and Society pretty big Vision. He was the first founder to ever say this to be a trillion-dollar opportunity. He's wrong. It's like a trillion dollars and until I called all these people so I was like, you know, you call people and I was like, hey, can I talk to anyone in every single person you connected me to and every single person. I reached out to one of them actually was the founder of a brat but at the time it's called Financial Bill party. I ended up talking all these people and they were all just the smartest

like most ambitious. People like it when you're in an area where it's like all the smartest most ambitious. Do you like? The crazy people? They were a little nuts. Like all of them little like, I'm still that is true. Like everyone's a little bit of and the until I like doing diligence is really about like I and I understand people and I'm an investor for a long time. Like I'm not a traitor. So like James and I probably have a different system by my system is by hold forever and I'm not good it turned out because of

crypto is like the test adventure and being a hedge fund, right? Like it's like am I going to hold for 10 years? Or am I going to like it out in 3 weeks? And like the and I we we decided early on when we realize this was going to be a decision that we have a maid, make we very much. Hope for a long, long time decentraland. Tune in for about 4 years. I mean Bitcoin, we've been a very long time. So we try to invest. Like we're going to be owners for a long time. If you if you don't want to hold it for 5 minutes everyday at

5 years. Don't hold it for 5 minutes. I think that's the thing, unless it's super fun. That's my added to. It is nice to be super fun thing to do and I follow where people are having the most fun and you'll do very, very, well. It sort of my my new Trent but it's like do diligence. Like don't listen to your best friend, or your like, like, dude, look into it, read about it. There's so much information online and also, you know, what's crazy about the crypto space. You can literally call

anyone like you could email or text or call and everyone will respond to an e-mail text or call. Like, and they'll all say, We all want the market to grow. So we want new people in, so we're like very accepting of anyone who's coming in. So if, if you, if you email someone in the hey, what do you think about the XYZ? Like, we'll probably have a template response. I will respond, right? Like we're going to get get back to you and try to help you understand the market better. Look at, you know, read the Bitcoin whitepaper. I generally just the Bitcoin ethereum, if they're

just starting out a little figure, it out. I figure out. It sounds like your kind of counterculture. But like pushing boundaries at like, when you see a bunch of smart people on a room, you're like, okay, what's going on over there? And you've had enough experience where you can gain their trust is a lot of times, those folks are looking around it. I think I'd be season going, like, you know, where are you found her BC, or you just a b, c person. Did you wear for normal people?

Chili is like where everyone else sees obstacles. They see opportunity, and it's like, always, that's always wanted it. It's like if ever ever has like, no, you couldn't do that because of XYZ that person's like, well, I'm pretty sure I could do XYZ, so, Definitely going to do that and you want to find the people who just like, don't see the barriers. They're just like, this is how the world works. Okay, I'll change it. And then I wanted to ask you this kind of same diligence question, but from almost like a grayscale position where, you know, you

had Bitcoin fun. You got other kind of McNeil mix funds now and, you know, I saw there's other ones on the horizon. I mean, how are you guys doing diligence around? What's next? There? Great question and I think your first and foremost. I mean obviously grayscale, you know doesn't give kind of investment investment advice, but I think about our products. You know, what we're looking at is really just finding things that we think are both going to be you, no compelling opportunities for our clients and we obviously want to put them through kind of the rigorous

test. So, you know, things that we have to do to bring them to, you know, you at work. And I have of you right now, I want to step back and explain kind of the way that you do and think about the evolution of, you know, what the space, you know, where it's come from. We know what's going on here. I got a baby where it's going just to give some high-level framing for folks. So you don't want me to barbecue, probably just what Brian said, which is that we're going to kind of be on either. Wants to see what's happening. Here is the internet. In my view is really becoming its own.

Emerging-market, digital economy countries in the cloud. Things like a theory of, these are their own internet native. You do Global Concepts Auburn Cloud economy. And if you think about what is happening here, with the transformation of the internet, from his kind of centralized owned, you know, economies by the big tech companies. Write what's happening is these economies, he's really mature and kind of similar to what you could think of your physical, you might look like as a mature and like the early waves of that have been things like a value money

trust around a financial system and that's really kind of what we saw with, you know, Bitcoin Litecoin zcash. What kind of early waves of the kind of first successful way of acid young next wave, right? If you think about any maturing conomy is after you have system for money and value are. What do you mean next music? It really does cloud infrastructure things. Like, you know, what, the area and Solana that really gave you enough or contract, really legal agreements, the launch and corporate digital logic that you've had, you know, this wave

isn't built within these respective areas economies. And the first probably most successful way of the folks are really seen market. Share really was decentralized Finance. So just like in a traditional economy, you're going to need a financial sector to finance the building and in the creation and growth and everything else in the traditional economy. In the same thing that happened with the other us and its early days. The financial sector was a large share of the economy there with the largest here for sometime. Now, what we're seeing is that as a Comedy Central,

this financial sector who started to finance, other really, kind of key areas of the crypto economy things like, I really a new consumer segments and this consumer segment is really, you know, looking at this digital economy and saying, people want to have sex with spirits and they won't have value across these things. Just like we all cars and we purchase our and we purchase other things and you know where that's transforming next you. In. My view is really been that in August in the infrastructure has to be built out to kind of some of the next way of this

kind of attack and that infrastructure on the cloud side to enable what eventually I think he comes, right? Like being everyone's really talking about today, which is this kind of metaverse type of virtual internet reality world. And I think that that's kind of where we're headed or at least that's kind of the theme in there. You know, I kind of think about from islands of kind of looking at the world and that's kind of the evolution that, you know, might be useful for helping, folks, contextualize. What is happening here. That and just one more question. It's it's you know people that died

in the last 2 years. Like I was at this. Bitcoin ETF is going to come this. Bitcoin ETF is going to come in. It's like people even buying gbtc in their retirement accounts for years. Now. What's a donation there? Like why like, why does that matter? Why does ETF matter versus white people? Carti do with the fonts? Well, I think that, you know, for some people I think it's just as kind of a stamp of maturity which is really a step forward and I think that's a good thing. So, yeah, I think some folks view Unity. F as a sign of

maturity of the crypto economy, kind of coming into the mainstream with, you know, the name of the US Financial system, and I think that that's obviously could sign for kind of growth in investment to come. I think it's trust right like where the Crypt crypt of communities build trust with the rest of the world to make it look legitimate. And ETF is a sign that the traditional Financial system, right? I was talking about the emergence of computing, like, all the stuff I was picturing us and we're at like, stage 1 of like digital economy

is. So we're like Gilgamesh with shells, like trading shells or whatever with the. And I was like, wow, we're going to look back on this 2000 years of you. Like how they did that. It's ridiculous. You for the imagination trip. I just went on at you. I just got up another livestream with that a project vidt. That's they, they've turned Rembrandt's into nfts. And now we're talking about like the metaverse and you know, walking into an hour. Collection in the metaverse and being able to buy this Rembrandt, you know, it's like you actually could do that now.

Like, it's actual like I was, he's not there's not a ton of scale there, but it's definitely possible. It's pretty quickly. One, comment, on top of that money for this digital artwork. And how can you work this much? And I think that if you step back and you have this lens and then just described, like if the theory is literally a new economy in the cloud, that's what it is in 100 years from now. It's in my view. Like if you own one of the blue-chip, the top early elections,

it's like investing in like, you know, post French like revolutionary art and like owning something from like the early formation of the society won't like what that becomes and turns of cultural significance. / 5. Can a hundred years, you know, I think it's maybe maybe you should call Adams, you know, philosophy on the kind of don't sell but that's not about if. I just, just keep it rigid rated at spend more money on frivolous things. And I'm shopping at on Twitter, like people see that

and it's a status symbol that like, people see that, and the butt, and I'm online what? Eight hours a day, and it's persistently, there and people are viewing it, where I buy a Lamborghini and I drive it for five minutes a day or whatever. And for the same purpose, which is to show that I own a Lamborghini probably or the driving fast on a race car track, but I've seen that use case before the like, I think, I think I know if I mean, I have a whole thesis. Starting with difficult to

explain, to people who are like all these things are just jpegs. Well, you know, it's kind of the same as like, when people get at the end of the first kind of high-paying job. And I like, I can't believe they're paying me. This much money is a call to paint it. You're worth it. Right? If people are paying this, they're they're worth it, cuz they're worth it to those people in there. Something there George. I'm sorry. No, I don't but it. But I think, what, what, Adam was just speaking about, is, again, kind of hitting the nail on the head. I could be, you know, the

Gateway, the Trojan Horse. For a lot of other things to come. I think that one of the things that, you know, we're just talking about a nicking, the tip of the iceberg with artwork, but, but in my mind, again, coming from the Securities background, and I look at all the different assets that are out there, that will detail. Can eyes are digitized, and obviously commercial real estate is one is just absolutely got into a massive Bullseye around. And I know people already doing commercial real estate in a very, very small scale. Overtime. What is artwork or Collectibles or commercial

real estate, zero doubt that is going to be so possession of everything. Yeah, I was in when I when I asked you guys. What you guys were going to give her one for the holidays. I was hoping someone would say enough to use because I feel it's like Adam like you were saying, you know, used to give people Bitcoin and Bitcoin was the first way in a little bit of aetherium. And now it's NFC East, right? And then someone wants to go buy a Top Shot, so they want to go get in there and they have to figure out what these addresses are and how to do it and it's something fun for them to pursue and

we're kind of moving into this next stage of you ax and you know, better versus and it's just a more fun way to get people on board and everyone becomes an investor because everything I'm not I'm going to buy some right now for my family. I want to hop into the most exciting thing, we could possibly talk about which is stable coins and we can talk a little bit about I mean, Have a place in someone's portfolio. And what are some of these other options that are available to people with that, you know, are utilizing stablecoins. Like,

you know, you think I don't know what the Avy is on the local Wells Fargo savings account right now, but it's probably less than what era is pain on anchor. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I am going to go to the bathroom. So I have a portfolio and to Mia's table coins as part of the portfolio just bring stability. Everything else, is Super Bowl the tile? And it's where the market is going to affect the value of whatever it is. And it's a good thing. The other thing is that, you know, you're you're right. The best savings account

probably gives you 1.5% of the US and I know we I think we would like to raise 9% there, like you're in defy, the crazy 25-30 50%, a few eyes until, you know, you have cashed. That's sitting there and generating that type of deal for you. That's a no-brainer. But at the same time just, you know, just in my perspective, on this table, and bring to me is just having The Preserve choking on his phone that I can use to buy it. If I think that's where I probably personally see the most used is because you don't like

using a non round getting cash and doing all the bad stuff to buy it. If it takes time and you might probably lose the opportunity and for me, it's a good, you know, it's just right there and I can use it anytime to buy into any of the things that, you know, And James, are you when your training, are you training back into stablecoins? When you're moving around or like I feel like there's such an opportunity for folks to trade me back into USD. And then, you know, maybe they don't know how long they're going to

hold that. Depending on what some of of cast of using, but if I could trade back, why aren't I turning back into a stable coin? That's that's getting me 8% at that moment in time. So I feel like I'm allergic to dollars at this point. Really what I using for the castle ternative. When I'm exiting out of my trade. Go back into stablecoins. It makes it makes me much more responsive and Nimble opportunity. As I can put the cash there, 24 hours a day to work and then it is a side benefit that you can go into some of these different the

park. You're a sister. That's great. But absolutely just the ability to use it to pay people to buy things that The Hideout be ready for when that happens, is that 3 Mi is a key in my car strategy in Georgia on the new exchange. Are you guys going to be utilizing stablecoins? And some of the parents? Is it going to be USD Fiat on ramps? What does that look like? So at launch it'll be whatever has the main stablecoin on there and try to be rolling out further coins as we launch them with the demand dictates. So, you know, yesterday was very

interesting with US. Government coming down and speaking about stablecoins and potentially wanted to turn the issuer's into financial institutions and I hope they seriously reconsider a lot of this. That being said, I think that in stablecoins, you do have to make sure you going back to due diligence that you have to look at who the issue or is it, make sure you understand the cloud because what we found coming out of 2008 is if you have something that is over collateralized, but the underlying collateral is junk. All you have is Is I'm not pointing fingers but like

everything else we discussed on the panel. It really gets down to individual investors and Traders. Not doing a little bit of due diligence and finding out what's going on and making sure the right choice, but I do like it for the butt of lending and borrowing componentry doctor really worried about the underlined. Now, there's no volatility price fluctuations of poses some other coins and have to worry about margin. So I think stablecoins will pave the way really for you know, digital dollars or CBD seeds and things of that nature. I think the governments around the world have been

watching these things very, very closely and hopefully they have a copy of them in a good way. And we will talk about this with cdc's like all the time cuz we're like, okay, the US government decide to do this. What what chain do they build on? Like what Al Gore and looks like. How do you decide that? Where does it get settled? Do they create their own or do we just have alligators in every, like, you know, every treasury building? Like how does this work? Where are the servers? And I think it's kind of interesting to think like, well, are they going to build something brand-new? Like

98% of dollars are already digital. It's just an interesting question to figure out. Do they build on a theory? I'm like every transaction going to cost $84 the next two years. Like how does this this whole thing work? I know. It's an open question for anyone. Government government and you want to do you want to see me to see what's changed you building on? I don't mean to bash the government because that's to Classic crypto. Okay, but when I read the financial times, it's like reading history. Like it happened a long time ago,

everything and they're all proposing things that will be Irrelevant in about 6 months. And it's like every time I read it, I just think it's some point that, you know, let the, let the internet feed the country. It's going to deserve to be in like, the let it, let it Roam and be free. And I think that's, that's the market that we have to keep free and it's going to be the battle that's going to be over the next right now. It's like a war between Facebook. Google. That's the the Big 5 battle between that and the government. And the next skating by right underneath that

like and then crypto just gets to be there like try it. Like we're just doing we're doing our thing. Like we're just building our things and then all the sudden it's the thing that frees everyone from like internet. Hierarchy, is it just the financial times as their website. Also have that pinkish q that the paper is that does it? Subscribe to financial. I got to do something consistently, right? Like I got to have a thing. Every time I read it's like them all, the government's getting together, a G20 and talking about how

we're really hoping that like climate change. It's going to be better than ice 10 years and not doing anything like and then printing more money and not doing anything. So I don't know. Like is my favorite little low. Yeah, but also I see everyday entrepreneurs, actually doing things without the capital and like, that gives me hope. Right? Like, so I see this this tool with the bridge that Gap somehow, any other comments on cbc's a girl, should I move to the next one? Move to the next one. It is where

you guys in a little bit to, you know, where we're doing the next. And I know it was always like the next billion users, right? Where do they come from? Cuz that's what they have to think about. What where do our next billion users come from in crypto and maybe David, you could start us. Great question. I think if we look at kind of where you should have been coming from lately that maybe is one indication because I think it's were entering this consumer segment application, you know, obviously the consumer economy is the part of the economy that everyone

interact with and how to invest into deep fry and you're setting up digital in financial system. So everyone's kind of buying something good people are mostly for the most part engaged in the entertainment culture. I think what's Happening Now with an F teases, you know, one piece of that you're seeing a lot of mainstream. Also figures, right? I mean, celebrity easy way to say artist celebrities. These people are getting involved in these things. And that's probably one way that folks move into the right now owning

crypto in ways that they don't even know and I think, you know, the first I mean, the hardest part about getting over it. Prepare like getting into Crypt of a really the hardest part is just setting up a wallet writing down your seed phrase. Running it down again. So you don't lose it putting in two places and like taking ownership of your security in your ass. It's like you're in and, you know, I think that's kind of the one hurdle we need to get to. But but I think as we kind of moved to, you know, these things

right? The consumer Parts, the gaming Parts, the things that are more entertainment-related, I think that's probably part of it. And nobody can I think they think this whole thing just continues to grow cuz it's still dark. You're a really good James where we have these crossover between a physical and virtual lives, and that's just naturally brings people. And then they, you know, what, what. They was talking about the complexity of the Wallace, this stuff. Just go away. When it's as easy to sign up for PlayStation. Is it to get your wallets in

those communities? Are really where were you should see that big influx of users are using these assets without necessarily even knowing that using the liquor glasses. Yeah. We're still waiting for that Pokemon go moment, you know where everyone's just like doesn't know they're being trained to write about what like mixed reality is. And it's like I still feel like we're to part with crypto where you know, you're explaining from the beginning like all the devil's, men problem bubble eyes, like imagine you on Instagram. If you had explained what TCP IP and access to this computer that has

more data, we're still there and we need to get past that that's all I want to hop it to my next question that we get a couple of like a minute left here. I'm snap your fingers whom this tool exists in our space, in our industry. Like what do you wish with built fully at school right now? That's not and you can't be an appeaser metaverse. A platform for lawyers to share their knowledge around crypto that kind of consistent message. I like that. I go back to a comment I made earlier which is the tokenization of everything. It would be phenomenal if I

could buy. I think either. Michael Saylor Tim was speak about it during their second if I could buy a floor of a building or one corner of a building. And again, that's just one example of things that are going to be coming down the pipe. You could be classic cars could be hard as we're assessing with the Rembrandts, you know, if you look in the barn world credit card receivables, autoverse, you both all these things are going to be tokenized and I think that's going to be fascinating when that comes. Yeah. I think you just add to that. I would say that one of the examples that I

can me and play. It's a no-brainer is probably airline miles or credit card points. I have like one, I knew what the heck was and you know Are you still working at San Fernando Court? It was just a no-brainer for me to like, okay, why why doesn't why have hasn't anybody could have taken that choke nice and put on the blockchain and make it to you. But with other assets, bring that efficiency to the closest Dairy, Queen. Last to. I think. The whole purpose of cryptos, unlocking, sort of financial products that we had roughly in the United States, to the

whole world. My, if I could Snap, My Fingers would be owning a million Acres of the ocean. So, because I believe, we need to unlock Capital to real-world problems, and that would be awesome. So, that's, that would be my LG, my, it works, right answer. I'm all about it. I'm going to just give like to practical things that are like kind of right infrastructure level that. It just took pain points that exist, but maybe we better one just like doing And I think like, we all try really hard at it and I think we all spend a lot of time on it. And I think for the most part

people get it, right, but it's just really hard and I think around that would be good because I think still have some opportunity in like a business, a structure world than the other part, but maybe not at like, you know, the quality that it could be just like a portfolio tracking software with a lot of assets, included and and move into your traditional realm of traditional asset. Has these markets, you know, obviously merge and become part of a larger global

economy. So yeah, they're right. Should be adding onto Davis. Think if if I could have my account not Know if I did well or not throughout the year. It's just, they charge more. I'm sure you guys will make you guys a plethora of knowledge coming from all of you with investing across the entire ecosystem. So truly appreciate. It is a pleasure and you guys have a good rest of your day, and we'll hand it back to Jessica. Thank you.

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